Band lineups you wish would have gone on for longer

[BernieTaupson]

Nothing gets past you does it Sparky. We all know that.

[Love_Industry]

Don Dokken (solo band with Norum, Billy White, and Ken Mary)

When was Mary in DD's solo band? AFAIK they started with Swedish drummer Hempo Hildén (who also was in John Norum's solo band) and did some photos and demos with him, and for the album and tour they had another Swede, Mikkey Dee. Anyway wouldn't Mary be busy with HOL and Fifth Angel around that time?

[Love_Industry]

Hell yeah... between them, Viv and Vandy couldn't write a commercial jingle, which is why Viv quit and SyVy got paid a million dollars to rescue SOTT under cover of Adrian's "arthritis".

Remember that the whole line-up was hired to play in videos and tour with an album that was already out. Nobody knew how big it would be and they were capable enough to play other people's songs opening for Aerosmith, Mötley and whoever.

I can just imagine Cov and Kalodner thinking when the tour ended: "Fuck.... now we have to get a hit album out of these clowns".... and started mining the old albums and even redid Vandenberg's only solo hit.

But didn't Viv quit because he wanted more money and Cov refused? Not because Cov wanted to write with him and he wasn't up to the task?

[Bono Nettencourt]

Yeah true the whole 87 thing was such a Frankenstein that it's amazing that they were able to got on tour and put those songs over as well as they did. BTW they did a headlining leg in early 88 too, which I saw and they were great. Which Vandenberg song did they rework?

[Van Ailin']

Don Dokken (solo band with Norum, Billy White, and Ken Mary)

When was Mary in DD's solo band? AFAIK they started with Swedish drummer Hempo Hildén (who also was in John Norum's solo band) and did some photos and demos with him, and for the album and tour they had another Swede, Mikkey Dee. Anyway wouldn't Mary be busy with HOL and Fifth Angel around that time?

I believe Ken is on "The Hunger."

[Earl Skakel]

When Ace quit the first time, Paul was looking for a Rhoads/Lee type of guitarist for KISS. IMO, shredding is not KISS-like at all. KISS needed a rock guitarist, not a heavy metal guitarist. They were never a metal band, although some of their songs are metal or at least metal-ish. When Mark was fired, Bruce was the guy, because he could be flashy, but that wasn't the only thing in his bag. He was a melodic rock guitarist who had a bluesy background. He could do the Van Halen stuff when needed, but the majority of his stuff fit the KISS mold. Mark and Vinnie, style-wise, were not compatible with KISS.

My first KISS concert was on the "Lick It Up" tour. Vinnie sucked playing Ace's stuff. One obnoxious shred fest after another. So not KISS' style. Paul knew he didn't fit the band, music-wise, personality-wise, and even height-wise. That's all on Paul and Gene for hiring him and not properly planning Ace's replacement. They did not properly schedule writing and recording of the new lp, finding a replacement, and rehearsal for the next tour.

I don't think Ace would have done well in the early/mid 80's with KISS with these guys being in vogue at the time
Van Halen
Lee
Rhoads
Demartini to a degree although never known as a shredder
among many others like Gillis....

I didn't mind Vinnie free styling on Ace's solos and riffs but I get why people didn't like him or St John for simply not being Ace. I will say I think Bruce was probably the best fit because he does what he's told and causes virtually no headache unlike Vinnie who was so nuts he got kicked out of The Vinnie Vincent Invasion WTF?

It all depends on the songs. A 20 second lead guitar solo in a song doesn't sell the song. KISS, with Ace or anyone else, would succeed if they had catchy, memorable songs.

During the grunge era you had bands like Gin Blossoms and Toad The Wet Sprocket having songs on the radio. Those tracks weren't grunge. Write a good, catchy song and you may have a hit.

KISS, on the other hand, went a big heavier with "Revenge". They got some exposure on Headbanger's Ball with "Unholy", but nothing else from that cd caught on on radio. Years later, they did get some radio play with "Jungle", a grungy song after the grunge era happened.

My problems with VV and MSJ weren't that they weren't Ace, but rather their styles had nothing to do with KISS' sound. In concert you expect to hear the majority of the solo in a song played like it was on the lp, but with VV that didn't happen. Plus, to be fair, Paul and Gene wanted the tempo of the songs played faster in concert. They wanted the older songs to sound current like the new songs.

Bruce worked well in KISS because he played for the song. VV played for himself.

I kind of like Vinnie and the 1 show Mark played live almost updating Ace's sound from 70's jam type sound ala Page to Rhoads/Lee type but I get why most people don't like that era. I just enjoy the guitar work on Animalize although at times it is a bit busy it's more restrained than say either of the 2 Vinnie Vincent Invasion albums! I do think oddly enough at least on the Lick It Up album Vinnie was a good paring with Gene and Paul as they restrained him and reigned him in and he updated them to the sound they wanted. Live that was another story with him!

[Love_Industry]

Yeah true the whole 87 thing was such a Frankenstein that it's amazing that they were able to got on tour and put those songs over as well as they did. BTW they did a headlining leg in early 88 too, which I saw and they were great. Which Vandenberg song did they rework?

"Burning Heart" off the debut.

I know they did a 1988 headlining tour, but that wasn't planned from the start AFAIK, only after the album blew up. Or maybe they had some UK & Japan shows lined up.
Always wanted to see that tour but had to wait until late on the SOTT tour to see Whitesnake as they didn't play Europe.

[Bono Nettencourt]

No don't think it was. "Give Me All Your Love" had just come out as a single. Great White opened.

Never heard of them redoing Burning Heart - was it rejected/shelved?

[Love_Industry]

No don't think it was. "Give Me All Your Love" had just come out as a single. Great White opened.

Never heard of them redoing Burning Heart - was it rejected/shelved?

Yes, they tried that and one more old Whitesnake song Ain't Gonna Cry No More for SOTT but ended up not using them.
IIRC, both those songs and two more unreleased originals Kill for the Cut and Parking Ticket are on the deluxe box of SOTT.

[Bono Nettencourt]

Wow. Didn't know any of that. No wonder Kalodner went out and got Vai. Shit was dire.

[kytepunches]

The first Danzig line up . He completely lost the plot after they left.

[cc117]

KISS with Ace Frehley and Eric Carr.

[Hellsinkey]

Don Dokken (solo band with Norum, Billy White, and Ken Mary)

AFAIK they started with Swedish drummer Hempo Hildén

Strange to see Hilden mentioned here. He was from Finland, as two others from Trash (the band). He died two years ago.

[risingfarce]

I don't think Ace would have done well in the early/mid 80's with KISS with these guys being in vogue at the time
Van Halen
Lee
Rhoads
Demartini to a degree although never known as a shredder
among many others like Gillis....

I didn't mind Vinnie free styling on Ace's solos and riffs but I get why people didn't like him or St John for simply not being Ace. I will say I think Bruce was probably the best fit because he does what he's told and causes virtually no headache unlike Vinnie who was so nuts he got kicked out of The Vinnie Vincent Invasion WTF?

It all depends on the songs. A 20 second lead guitar solo in a song doesn't sell the song. KISS, with Ace or anyone else, would succeed if they had catchy, memorable songs.

During the grunge era you had bands like Gin Blossoms and Toad The Wet Sprocket having songs on the radio. Those tracks weren't grunge. Write a good, catchy song and you may have a hit.

KISS, on the other hand, went a big heavier with "Revenge". They got some exposure on Headbanger's Ball with "Unholy", but nothing else from that cd caught on on radio. Years later, they did get some radio play with "Jungle", a grungy song after the grunge era happened.

My problems with VV and MSJ weren't that they weren't Ace, but rather their styles had nothing to do with KISS' sound. In concert you expect to hear the majority of the solo in a song played like it was on the lp, but with VV that didn't happen. Plus, to be fair, Paul and Gene wanted the tempo of the songs played faster in concert. They wanted the older songs to sound current like the new songs.

Bruce worked well in KISS because he played for the song. VV played for himself.

I kind of like Vinnie and the 1 show Mark played live almost updating Ace's sound from 70's jam type sound ala Page to Rhoads/Lee type but I get why most people don't like that era. I just enjoy the guitar work on Animalize although at times it is a bit busy it's more restrained than say either of the 2 Vinnie Vincent Invasion albums! I do think oddly enough at least on the Lick It Up album Vinnie was a good paring with Gene and Paul as they restrained him and reigned him in and he updated them to the sound they wanted. Live that was another story with him!

True that VV was restrained by Paul and Gene. They also had Rick Derringer play the solo on "Exciter".

On one of the songs on "Animalize" Paul tried to get Mark to play a part and Mark wasn't getting it, so Paul played it instead. On Paul's songs he knew what he wanted the solos to be, so he'd go over them with the lead guitarist in the band at that time. Some of the melodic solos he decided to play himself.

[GoodJudge]

The first Danzig line up . He completely lost the plot after they left.

Difficult to argue with that.

[Aerosmith87]

The 2006-2010ish New York Dolls rebirth had an amazing band. Sami Yaffa and Steve Conte were an amazing fit, in addition to David Johanssen and Sylvain Sylvain. Drummer was solid, too. They had the perfect blend of being proficient to great at their roles, but being loose & tight at the same time.

[Hellsinkey]

The 2006-2010ish New York Dolls rebirth had an amazing band. Sami Yaffa and Steve Conte were an amazing fit. Drummer was solid, too. They had the perfect blend of being proficient to great at their roles, but being loose & tight at the same time.

Those guys are now in Michael Monroe's band.

[rubysdad]

Sex Pistols with Matlock.

[Aerosmith87]

The 2006-2010ish New York Dolls rebirth had an amazing band. Sami Yaffa and Steve Conte were an amazing fit. Drummer was solid, too. They had the perfect blend of being proficient to great at their roles, but being loose & tight at the same time.

Those guys are now in Michael Monroe's band.

Yep - good backing back for sure. I feel like MM's music doesn't lend itself to too much guitar "wandering", but Conte and Sylvain were real good together.

[El Vampiro Blanco]

He didn't have any writing credits and they had to bring Kulick in to finish a couple of the songs so I wonder how instrumental he really was in the recording of that album. He also later said that the arthuritis was a coverup because he pretty much left because they couldn't stand him and vv.

The Reiter's Syndrome was real. Paul wanting to get rid of him was real. They gave him a chance at three shows and knew that he was out and Bruce was in.

I met him once. My guess it was pre-meth days. He was at a fan run KISS convention. He was only there for the paycheck. Looked like he would have rather been any place else.

So he actually fit in perfectly with Kiss! None of the ex members who did conventions ever looked like they wanted to be there. Worst being Ace...

[El Vampiro Blanco]

KISS with Vincent. That first VVI as a Kiss album would have been fantastic. Great songs, no high whiney singer and no ridiculous guitar solos.

Rainbow with Dio.

Sabbath with Gillan.

Ozzy with Jake.

[GreatWhiteSnake]

OK Alice Cooper with the Ultra Latex Band (Davey Johnstone, Steve Hunter)...

[risingfarce]

He didn't have any writing credits and they had to bring Kulick in to finish a couple of the songs so I wonder how instrumental he really was in the recording of that album. He also later said that the arthuritis was a coverup because he pretty much left because they couldn't stand him and vv.

The Reiter's Syndrome was real. Paul wanting to get rid of him was real. They gave him a chance at three shows and knew that he was out and Bruce was in.

I met him once. My guess it was pre-meth days. He was at a fan run KISS convention. He was only there for the paycheck. Looked like he would have rather been any place else.

So he actually fit in perfectly with Kiss! None of the ex members who did conventions ever looked like they wanted to be there. Worst being Ace...

I've seen the following at fan run KISS conventions:

Eric Carr - Very happy to be there. We were having a snowstorm and he still flew in from NYC to be there.

Vinnie Vincent - He was kind of meh. He was talkative during his Q&A.

Mark St. John - As I mentioned, he would rather have been anywhere else.

Bruce Kulick - He was happy to be there at the 3 conventions. At one of them he, Eric Singer, and Karl Cochran jammed and did a great job. Video is on YouTube.

Eric Singer - He was happy to be there and jam. He did a drum clinic at a nearby music store the following day.


I've never cared or bothered to meet Ace and Peter.

[Dyslexicheart]

Guess what? We all know you didn't care to meet Ace & Peter, because you've said similar things approximately 10,000 times on this board. Over, and over, and over. It was tiresome years ago.

[Love_Industry]

KISS with Vincent. That first VVI as a Kiss album would have been fantastic. Great songs, no high whiney singer and no ridiculous guitar solos.

According to the book Time Traveler, Vinnie demoed five songs for the next Kiss album with Hirsh Gardner on drums in early 1984 and according to Gardner, Vinnie was on the phone with Gene and /or Paul every day when they were recording so Vinnie's time with Kiss wasn't over when the tour ended as was previously thought. There WAS an alternate universe where he could have played on Animalize and got five of his songs on there.

The songs were: Boyz are Gonna Rock, Shoot U Full of Love, Animal, Twisted and Gypsy in her Eyes which didn't make it to the VVI albums. According to the book, those (mostly instrumental" demos are superb and make the VVI versions sound lifeless.

[alexleehooker]

DLR Band
coverdale/page
GnR with Adler
Dogs Damour with Bam/steve/jo
Crue with Corabi (and then bring vince back later, as a 5 piece,. touring best of everything and NOT making those sixx am albums with the crue logo on the front)
Brides of Destruction with corabi and Nikki for the second album

[DrumminAway]

Don Dokken (solo band with Norum, Billy White, and Ken Mary)

When was Mary in DD's solo band? AFAIK they started with Swedish drummer Hempo Hildén (who also was in John Norum's solo band) and did some photos and demos with him, and for the album and tour they had another Swede, Mikkey Dee. Anyway wouldn't Mary be busy with HOL and Fifth Angel around that time?

Ken Mary played on the song The Hunger (and killed it, btw). Rest of the CD was Mikkey Dee.

[Love_Industry]

Any line-up of Celtic Frost. They didn't keep any line-up for more than one album.

[Bono Nettencourt]

coverdale/page

Never realized til recently that Restless Heart was the C/P band with Vandy subbed in for Page.

[AlexVonHaig]

Lynch Mob with Oni Logan

Veruca Salt with Mary and Louise

Mest with the 2 Lovato brothers and the Lovato cousin

4 piece Motorhead with Wurzel and Campbell