**OFFICIAL Association Football 2012/2013 Season thread**

[shocked_the_monkey]

And who is Fraser Forster! Kind of sad the state of English goalkeeping these days.

He's getting a lots of props recently. Always hard to tell how good he is when he plays in a weak league. I thought he was ok in Champion's League. He's young for a goalkeeper and again thinking of the future I'd have him as back up rather than Foster.

Hart has been pretty good this season after a poor 2012-13. If we're talking about the state of English goalkeeping, aside from Buffon and Neuer, who would you say is consistently better than Hart amongst European teams.

[MickeyG]

Hart has been pretty good this season after a poor 2012-13. If we're talking about the state of English goalkeeping, aside from Buffon and Neuer, who would you say is consistently better than Hart amongst European teams.

Pelligrini dropped Hart earlier this season after his clanger against Chelsea. Courtois at Atletico has had a decent season.

As for the B team idea, I guess the FA have looked at what goes on in Spain and Germany and figured it might be worth a try. I recently read on a United forum that sometimes the U21's only play once a month in their current league format. This is worthless and is why so many go out on loan to other clubs. I don't know the answer, but looking at other countries that are successful at bringing through good players is a start, I guess. I'm guessing our coaching lower down is pretty shit though too.

[shocked_the_monkey]

Hart has been pretty good this season after a poor 2012-13. If we're talking about the state of English goalkeeping, aside from Buffon and Neuer, who would you say is consistently better than Hart amongst European teams.

Pelligrini dropped Hart earlier this season after his clanger against Chelsea. Courtois at Atletico has had a decent season.

True, I forgot that. But other than that there's no one close in England and as said I would back him over the majority of keepers in Europe.

[CliffByford]

As for the B team idea, I guess the FA have looked at what goes on in Spain and Germany and figured it might be worth a try. I recently read on a United forum that sometimes the U21's only play once a month in their current league format. This is worthless and is why so many go out on loan to other clubs. I don't know the answer, but looking at other countries that are successful at bringing through good players is a start, I guess. I'm guessing our coaching lower down is pretty shit though too.

I think it shits all over the actual competitive aspect of lower league football and won't work. German sides are scaling back their B teams because they're simply not producing players. Also, it'll give the big sides an excuse to hoover up any halfway decent prospect, swell squad sizes to ridiculous numbers and spit the excess out when inevitably they don't make the grade.

Of course, another reason that it's been proposed is down to the changes being instantly visible. Not for the FA the boring task of training up youth coaches to UEFA B standard or higher - let's not forget that Spain has 27,000 coaches at least at that level or above, England has about 1,500. That takes time, energy and investment. No, let's just fuck up lower league football, irrespective of the desires and ambitions of clubs occupying the lower reaches of the pro game (and their supporters).

Anyway, wasn't the Premier League originally touted to all and sundry as the solution to the England team?

[MickeyG]

I think it shits all over the actual competitive aspect of lower league football and won't work. German sides are scaling back their B teams because they're simply not producing players. Also, it'll give the big sides an excuse to hoover up any halfway decent prospect, swell squad sizes to ridiculous numbers and spit the excess out when inevitably they don't make the grade.

I agree about the squad sizes. It's bad enough now, and would get worse with this idea. Not completely sure about them not producing talent, there are some great players in Germanys world cup squad. Their midfield is overflowing with quality.

Of course, another reason that it's been proposed is down to the changes being instantly visible. Not for the FA the boring task of training up youth coaches to UEFA B standard or higher - let's not forget that Spain has 27,000 coaches at least at that level or above, England has about 1,500. That takes time, energy and investment. No, let's just fuck up lower league football, irrespective of the desires and ambitions of clubs occupying the lower reaches of the pro game (and their supporters).

Anyway, wasn't the Premier League originally touted to all and sundry as the solution to the England team?

Yep. The coaching is a big problem. Also, young kids in other countries get to spend more time actually being coached whereas in England by law they are restricted.

Not sure about the Premier League being created to produce better players for England, I think it was just so the top 20 (and really the top 6 or so), could have more control on how the league was run.

[MickeyG]

True, I forgot that. But other than that there's no one close in England and as said I would back him over the majority of keepers in Europe.

Yeah, pretty much this. Can't think of any decent English keepers that are as good as Hart. I think he gets some stick as people think he can be a bit cocky, and the media were falling over themselves to suck him off at one point.

[SebastianLeeDanzig]

I think it shits all over the actual competitive aspect of lower league football and won't work. German sides are scaling back their B teams because they're simply not producing players. Also, it'll give the big sides an excuse to hoover up any halfway decent prospect, swell squad sizes to ridiculous numbers and spit the excess out when inevitably they don't make the grade.

I agree about the squad sizes. It's bad enough now, and would get worse with this idea. Not completely sure about them not producing talent, there are some great players in Germanys world cup squad. Their midfield is overflowing with quality.

That's true, but nowadays pretty much all homegrown talent is drafted right from the clubs' youth sections. As players turn pro earlier and earlier, there's even less need for the B squads. They basically serve as a storage for excess players or disciplinary punishment for players in the doghouse. What's worse, as Cliff said, they just clog up the lower leagues with teams that by default bring no fans, no passion, no ambition even, as they can't be promoted to higher leagues - while traditional clubs with huge fan bases but little money are struggling for survival in the 4th, regional divisions.

[MickeyG]

It makes sense that if they're good enough, the young players go straight into the first team squad instead of hanging about in the B squad. Especially with home grown quotas now in place.

I haven't read anything about how they would implement this, but how could they fit all 20 premier league B squads into the lower leagues. They already play a ton of games lower down.

[shocked_the_monkey]

As someone who supports a Championship team (although presumably we'd be unaffected) I think it's a joke. There are teams in the 1st division like Sheffield Utd who have a 30000 seater stadium, yet i'd still fancy a Chelsea, Man Utd, Arsenal B team to finish ahead of them. Even in league 2 you've got teams with stadiums of around 10000 and similar in the Conference. League 1 and 2 teams already play far too many games as it is.

If the players are good enough they will play for the first team anyway. Didn't Wayne Rooney play his first game for Everton when he was 16?

The coaching thing is the main problem. Burton is a great idea and looks very impressive now it's finished, although arguably 15 years too late. France developed a similar centre of excellence about 10 years before they won the world cup.

[MickeyG]

I see Martino has left Barca, it would be funny as fuck if they went after Brenton.

[pieceofme]

My Hull friend won't be happy. Sounded like a good game though which is rare for an FA cup final.

Nice one Athletico. Hope they win the Champions League as well.

Sounds like Dortmand got robbed of a goal at the end of the second half.

[MickeyG]

After they went 2 up, Hull hardly did much going forward. Arsenal were best overall, and deserved it. Their season has been a strange one, and their fans will point to injuries for their failures. I struggle to see them pushing on for a title challenge any time soon though.

[SebastianLeeDanzig]

Sounds like Dortmand got robbed of a goal at the end of the second half.

Fuck them right in the ass. I loathe Bayern as the next guy, but BVB hools are the scum of the earth. I've never seen such mob mentality rioting all over the city like tonight. I'm not easily flustered, but it just took me three hours to even get home without getting the shit kicked out of me. And I wasn't anywhere near the stadium.

[jellyheadrobertson]

I see Martino has left Barca, it would be funny as fuck if they went after Brenton.

Would be funnier as fuck if they went after Moyes.

[jellyheadrobertson]

After they went 2 up, Hull hardly did much going forward. Arsenal were best overall, and deserved it. Their season has been a strange one, and their fans will point to injuries for their failures. I struggle to see them pushing on for a title challenge any time soon though.

You could feel the game changing soon after Hull's second. That little back heel by Giroud on Ramsey's goal was nice.

[MickeyG]

I see Martino has left Barca, it would be funny as fuck if they went after Brenton.

Would be funnier as fuck if they went after Moyes.

That fucker should never have a job again. I wouldn't even wish him on your lot.

[Hellsinkey]

I see Martino has left Barca, it would be funny as fuck if they went after Brenton.

Would be funnier as fuck if they went after Moyes.

That fucker should never have a job again. I wouldn't even wish him on your lot.

That fucker will never have to work again. What a stupid idea to give him a six year contract in the first place.

[MickeyG]

That fucker will never have to work again. What a stupid idea to give him a six year contract in the first place.

Apparently his payoff was in the "single millions".

[pieceofme]

That fucker will never have to work again. What a stupid idea to give him a six year contract in the first place.

Apparently his payoff was in the "single millions".

Yeah something in his contract that if he failed to quality for Europe he would only get one years wages. Still when its in the millions its not a bad job!

[Hellsinkey]

Moyes has punched somebody at a pub. At least he got to beat one this season.

[pieceofme]

Brutal for Athletico. Well, at least they won La Liga.

[Hellsinkey]

Yeah, so close. Brutal for Derby too.

[CliffByford]

Just got back from celebrating QPR's unlikely triumph. Redknapp can still suck a dick as far as I'm concerned; Derby should've won that easily. But they didn't.

YOU RRRRRRRSSS! YOU RRRRRRRSSS!

[MickeyG]

You can have Ashley Young off of United if you want, Cliffy!

[Tenacious_Dio]

Yeah, so close. Brutal for Derby too.

And Orient.

[Hellsinkey]

You can have Ashley Young off of United if you want, Cliffy!

Throw in Tom Cleverley too. And Fellaini.