Killeverything's (New)NeverEndingBaseballThread

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Killeverything's (New)NeverEndingBaseballThread

Postby killeverything » Tue Oct 14, 2008 11:13 am

It returns.

Glorious and powerful.

With the end of the season near, a lot of discussion needs to be had this off season. What is Ben Sheets' worth? Who won't the MFY sign? Does Texeria stay? Does Varitek go? How and the fuck does Minyana still have a job? PAP ( pitcher abuse points ) pertaining to Sabbath and his impending free agency. Was the Santana trade worth it for the Mets? etc.

Let them begin.
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Postby tin00can » Tue Oct 14, 2008 11:25 am

I predict - actually this is a wish - that the Angels will sign Teixeira and won't re-sign K-Rod or pick up the option on Garret Anderson. CC will go to the Dodgers. I have no idea where Manny ends up.
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Re: Killeverything's (New)NeverEndingBaseballThread

Postby JakeYonkel » Tue Oct 14, 2008 11:26 am

I'll play!

What is Ben Sheets' worth?


I'll bet he gets a Jason Schmidt contract (3 years, ~$45M). He's good as hell if healthy. I bet the Giants will throw stupid money at him. I don't see him signing on the east coast.

Who won't the MFY sign?


Me. Well, I think they'll go hard after Sabathia and D. Lowe, maybe Teixeira. If they miss out on Sabathia they'll gun for Burnett. But rest assured they're getting at least one of these guys. I don't think they'll wind up with Tex, though.

Does Texeria stay?


I really think so. But LA will decide to either break the bank on him or Sabathia, and I'm starting to think Sabathia might like to stay in the NL, so I think Teixeira will be an Angel, long-term.

Does Varitek go?


I think it's gonna be a Bernie Williams type situation with Varitek and Boston. Long-time player, not GREAT, but very good. Part of championships. Fan favorite. But clearly he's done, from an offensive standpoint. Boston gives up an out whenever the guy's up. He's shot. Could they offer him a one year deal? Yeah, I guess so. I mean, they don't exactly have a young catcher tearing it up on the farm. I think they'll get somebody like Gerald Laird and they're gonna have to let Varitek walk. (now watch Tek go 3/5 tonight against Tampa with a bomb)

How and the fuck does Minyana still have a job?


Great fucking question. The "let's sign every Latino player under the sun" has worked wonders. Luis Castillo, ladies and gentlemen! The Mets have just done such a piss-poor job from a PR standpoint over the last year or so. The handling of the Willie Randolph firing. Slyly re-upping Omar before they choked themselves out of a playoff spot. Going to offer a job to Jerry Manuel, who, face it, had just as much success as Willie did this year. Oh and let's not forget scheduling the Shea closing ceremony AFTER the last game to be played there, knowing full well they could have lost a playoff spot that day. Bad jobs all around.

PAP ( pitcher abuse points ) pertaining to Sabbath and his impending free agency.


I thouht about this myself - was it 'unethical' for Milwaukee to ride the guy down the stretch as much as they did? Maybe not, since they're not tied to him beyond 2008. Sabathia's a horse, no question. I'd be more concerned about his fat ass getting fatter at the end of the 4 or 5 year deal he's going to get than his arm, though.

Was the Santana trade worth it for the Mets? etc.


Absolutely. Guy should have won 20 games and been in the Cy Young discussion if not for the terrible Mets bullpen. How could it have not been worth it? They gave up NOTHING in the way of prospects for him. Essentially the got the guy as a free agent without giving up draft picks. No brainer.
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Postby killeverything » Tue Oct 14, 2008 12:00 pm

Geez I totally forgot about Manny. Like I've stated before, it would really surprise me if he ends up in NY. Cashman, etc. is not a fan of Manny. It would really surprise me. The Manny we see now is the "happy Manny". He's Boras' bitch. He wants another 100m contract. With Ned Colleti's obession of all things Red Sox, it's hard to see him not staying.

I think that it would be insane for Anaheim for to let K Rod walk, same with Teixeria. Tex's contract will hit astronomical levels with both Anaheim and NY wanting his services.

I think the interesting part will be the bidding for pitching. I know quality starting pitching is scarce, but with the amount of IP these guys did. I hope more GMs take PAP seriously. I see Tommy John's in the future for some unfortunately. Barry Zito contracts for everyone!
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Postby tin00can » Tue Oct 14, 2008 12:39 pm

killeverything wrote: to let K Rod walk, same with Teixeria. Tex's contract will hit astronomical levels with both Anaheim and NY wanting his services.


K-Rod is a huge gamble. His peripherals are dropping and his throwing motion is extremely violent. Dude falls off his feet after a pitch about a third of the time, which tells you he's overthrowing. I think the Angels figure Arredondo can replace him, or if Escobar is back and healthy he can do it as well. The only way he's back in Anaheim is if he takes a 3/$45 million contract (at most).
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Postby killeverything » Tue Oct 14, 2008 2:25 pm

tin00can wrote:
killeverything wrote: to let K Rod walk, same with Teixeria. Tex's contract will hit astronomical levels with both Anaheim and NY wanting his services.


K-Rod is a huge gamble. His peripherals are dropping and his throwing motion is extremely violent. Dude falls off his feet after a pitch about a third of the time, which tells you he's overthrowing. I think the Angels figure Arredondo can replace him, or if Escobar is back and healthy he can do it as well. The only way he's back in Anaheim is if he takes a 3/$45 million contract (at most).


Certainly K-Rod is a gamble, and he has a pretty violent delivery. Not unlike what sidelined Kerry Wood as a starter. I just think that it's a gamble worth taking. I wouldn't expect to see him have the career longevity of say Trevor Hoffman, but his arm isn't falling off tommorrow.

That all comes down to where you place value. I was thinking his chasing of the saves record was going to effect him. I thought it was poor usage personally. Yet, can you recall a time a manager wouldn't let his pitcher achieve a personal milestone in order to prepare for the post-season. Anaheim had a berth locked up when the season began practically. I just would hold off on making a judgement until all the season stats come in.

As I've said before, I'm highly curious about the PAP usage for some of the upcoming free-agents. Sabbathia especially. In K-Rod you have something special. He seems to go through waves with his peripherals. If you look at his 2003 season. He seemed to fall in love with the "K-Rod" moniker. Granted his IP jumped considerably, but he went to 2-4 in SV-BS. He righted the ship in 2004. I'm thinking maybe his faltering at times was attributed to chasing Thigpen's record. Unless further evidence comes out, and the price isn't too high. I think you re-sign him.
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Postby tin00can » Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:56 am

The thing about K-Rod's usage this year is that he wasn't taxed that much. He had a few one-out saves and I don't think he ever went over an inning. 68 innings pitched. Lidge has 69 innings, Rivera has 70, Papelbon had 69.1.
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Postby Punk » Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:45 am

I'll say Manny ends up in L.A. for good.

CC = Mets

Lowe = Yanks

Tex = Anaheim
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Postby JakeYonkel » Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:57 am

I read that Lowe's not interested in coming to the Yankees or Mets. Yeah, money talks, I know. But worth mentioning.
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Postby killeverything » Thu Oct 16, 2008 10:24 am

I couldn't see Lowe in a NY uniform. It would ( not unlike Manny ) surprise me to see the MFY FO go after him. Lowe has reported off the field troubles ( drinking, drinking in the clubhouse , etc. ) which is one of the reasons Epstein let him walk. That kind of goes against everything that NY stands for.

Plus what is repeatedly reported is Cashman wants Sabbathia, and one of the reasons they're clearing payroll ( not that they need to I know ), is to be able to land him in the offseason. Whether he'll return to the AL remains a mystery thus far.[/img]
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Postby Facedown » Sun Oct 19, 2008 3:47 am

Drink up, Joba.
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Postby Rainbow Bright » Sun Oct 19, 2008 1:34 pm

According to Duff McKagen, Tony LaRussa wanted the Mariners coaching gig. That could have been interesting. Now excuse me while I weep because our team blows ass.
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Postby killeverything » Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:52 am

Ha! This is fucking hilarious about poor Rahjah.

Estranged former Yankee Roger Clemens was "heartbroken" when his former team left him out of Sunday night's Stadium-farewell festivities, which included a video montage honoring the Bronx Bombers' greatest pitchers - but not him, a relative told The Post yesterday.

Clemens was sitting at home in hurricane-ravaged Texas, in front of a battery-operated television on his living room couch, when the team delivered a final crushing blow to its former star.

Clutching wife Debbie's hand on one side and mother-in-law Jan Wild's on the other, Clemens tuned in to his final team's last home game hoping for some recognition for helping win two World Series titles, Wild said.

But that Rocket never launched.

When the team played the video celebrating its greatest players at every position, the steroid-scandal-scarred Clemens was nowhere to be seen.

"Debbie and I held his hand while we watched the game, and he was heartbroken," said Wild, 70. "Not mad. He still loves baseball and the Yankees, but it was sad what they did to him."


Battery operated television that apparently gets ESPN? I feel bad that he only has one mansion in which he has to endure the hurricane and all, but this is too much.

Did "they treat him worse than Hitler?" :lol:
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Postby killeverything » Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:32 pm

Bump Goddamnit.

Alright. It's rumor time kids.

Apparently from the GM meetings. White Sox genius Kenny Williams seems to have had Nick Swisher and Javier Vazquez fall out of favor. The word on the street is he wants to move both of them.

Interesting situation for the Mighty Red Sox or MFY.

How under-valued is Swisher. Is he another Hinske? Who never again achieves his earlier success ( ROY 2003? ), or could he be a super-sub with 500ABs. I hope to fucking God something can get worked out. Swisher is owed a lot of money ( like Lugo ), but it could be worth it ( unlike Lugo ).

Guillen likes a "Nomah-esque" swing at the first pitch offense. Swisher is more of a patient hitter, something both BOS and NY covet. It seems to stem from that. Think of Youks and Swisher hitting back to back. Swisher in 2008 saw 4.58 P/PA, with Youk's 4.02. How fucking awesome would that be? With the inenvitable Nancy Drew's month-long DL stint, Lowell's age, Youk's flexibilty. This would be great off the bench.

Now the bad news. Apparently the hole at SS continues.
The Sox are open to having Julio Lugo return as a means of achieving excellent depth at shortstop at the start of the 2009 season. At the same time, the team is also exploring potential ways of moving him, whether an exchange of “bad” contracts with another team or by eating salary in hopes of getting a prospect. The Red Sox and White Sox (who are looking for a shortstop) could not find a fit for an exchange that would involve the likes of Lugo and Nick Swisher.
http://blogs.weei.com/alexspeier/2008/1 ... ake-shape/

Then of course that other team's needs. Who also could use him, assuming of course the Teix potential deal falls through.

The White Sox and Yankees have talked several times, including at length late Wednesday night, perhaps about outfielder/first baseman Nick Swisher. Williams and Yankees GM Brian Cashman are close. Could Yankees second baseman Robinson Cano be part of a swap? He is owed at least $27 million for the next four years and has fallen out of favor. Swisher is due $21 million for three years.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/ch ... 2293.story

Fuck it I'm bored. This time of year I go crazy. I think Swisher is way undervalued and if you get the chance at that jump on it. I'll be here tommorrow with some Peavy speculation. Sabbathia? You know as much as I do.
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Postby Royal Dudeness » Thu Nov 06, 2008 11:23 pm

that's pretty sad how Clemens was left out of the Yankees ceremony. Sure, the guy is a fucking liar, but it's not like he screwed over the Yankees. He HELPED them. They should have honored him in some way.
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Postby WhiteHouseSubsAC » Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:37 am

Something that Jake and I talked about last week may be coming true..ESPN is reporting that the Phillies have a lot of interest in Matt Holliday, presumably to replace Pat Burrell. They're going to be asking for a lot, and the Phillies don't like to part with their young talent. Still, it would be an upgrade for sure.
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Postby JakeYonkel » Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:40 am

Philly would be in GREAT shape if they could grab Holliday for prospects and lock him up for a few years. A core of Utley/Howard/Rollins/Holliday... holy shit.
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Postby killeverything » Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:44 am

Royal Dudeness wrote:that's pretty sad how Clemens was left out of the Yankees ceremony. Sure, the guy is a fucking liar, but it's not like he screwed over the Yankees. He HELPED them. They should have honored him in some way.


Lots of players have helped the Yankees. I don't really see what's sad about it. He's not a "Yankee". The guy spent practically his entire career in Boston, sorry but that's how he'll always be known. Same with Boggs. Who they honored.

And to say he didn't screw them over. Remember his half season 1.4 million a start contract, where he wasn't any better than a #5 starter? Much less not being jacked on the juice and not being able to refrain from limping off the mound in 3rd in the Playoffs. I'll never forgive him for game 6, let's all blame Buckner.

Fuck Rahjah.
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Postby killeverything » Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:48 am

JakeYonkel wrote:Philly would be in GREAT shape if they could grab Holliday for prospects and lock him up for a few years. A core of Utley/Howard/Rollins/Holliday... holy shit.


I knew lots of team's are wanting Holliday. That lineup right there is terrifying.

Oh yeah, Pedroia won a Gold Glove! Next it should be MVP.
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Postby WhiteHouseSubsAC » Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:50 am

JakeYonkel wrote:Philly would be in GREAT shape if they could grab Holliday for prospects and lock him up for a few years. A core of Utley/Howard/Rollins/Holliday... holy shit.


I would have to think that Jayson Werth earned the full time starting job with his play at the end of the year..his 2008 stats project to 30+ HR and almost 100 RBI if he had been the starter all year.

Howard/Rollins/Utley/Holliday/Werth= a shitload of HR and everyone but Howard has speed. That's a formidable lineup.
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Postby killeverything » Fri Nov 07, 2008 10:26 am

That's an extremely formidable line-up and puts Philly in the position to be competitive for a while.

The projections for 2009 come out mid-month. I'm curious to see what the numbers are for those guys. With their age, etc. There should only be an upside for all of them.

The only thing Philly has to worry about is lasting effects from the "hangover".
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Postby thejuggernaut » Fri Nov 07, 2008 11:13 am

killeverything wrote:
Royal Dudeness wrote:that's pretty sad how Clemens was left out of the Yankees ceremony. Sure, the guy is a fucking liar, but it's not like he screwed over the Yankees. He HELPED them. They should have honored him in some way.


Lots of players have helped the Yankees. I don't really see what's sad about it. He's not a "Yankee". The guy spent practically his entire career in Boston, sorry but that's how he'll always be known. Same with Boggs. Who they honored.

And to say he didn't screw them over. Remember his half season 1.4 million a start contract, where he wasn't any better than a #5 starter? Much less not being jacked on the juice and not being able to refrain from limping off the mound in 3rd in the Playoffs. I'll never forgive him for game 6, let's all blame Buckner.

Fuck Rahjah.


And the retirement to Houston.
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Postby JakeYonkel » Fri Nov 07, 2008 11:26 am

killeverything wrote:Oh yeah, Pedroia won a Gold Glove! Next it should be MVP.


If he wins the MVP I'm going to laugh really fucking hard.

Check his numbers versus Jeter's numbers in '06 - then Justin Morneau both years, since Morneau is likely to be the sitffest competition either way...
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Postby killeverything » Fri Nov 07, 2008 11:51 am

JakeYonkel wrote:
killeverything wrote:Oh yeah, Pedroia won a Gold Glove! Next it should be MVP.


If he wins the MVP I'm going to laugh really fucking hard.

Check his numbers versus Jeter's numbers in '06 - then Justin Morneau both years, since Morneau is likely to be the sitffest competition either way...


It's funny for sure. What the discussion was was Morneau vs. Pedroia for MVP. Now since Morneau's team missed the Playoffs? That leaves him as the biggest choice.

I disagree with the BBWA on damn near everything but keeping juicers out of the Hall. I dislike the fact numbers aren't used for awards. It was for the AL CY last year and I applaud them for it. Jake, you and I have battled long and hard over Pedro should have gotten the MVP for '99. If it wasn't a pitcher, the next obvious canidate was Jeter. Both were fucked. I might be just a TAD biased.....maybe just a little. Who else would be the biggest competition for the AL?
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Postby thejuggernaut » Fri Nov 07, 2008 11:56 am

killeverything wrote:
JakeYonkel wrote:
killeverything wrote:Oh yeah, Pedroia won a Gold Glove! Next it should be MVP.


If he wins the MVP I'm going to laugh really fucking hard.

Check his numbers versus Jeter's numbers in '06 - then Justin Morneau both years, since Morneau is likely to be the sitffest competition either way...


It's funny for sure. What the discussion was was Morneau vs. Pedroia for MVP. Now since Morneau's team missed the Playoffs? That leaves him as the biggest choice.

I disagree with the BBWA on damn near everything but keeping juicers out of the Hall. I dislike the fact numbers aren't used for awards. It was for the AL CY last year and I applaud them for it. Jake, you and I have battled long and hard over Pedro should have gotten the MVP for '99. If it wasn't a pitcher, the next obvious canidate was Jeter. Both were fucked. I might be just a TAD biased.....maybe just a little. Who else would be the biggest competition for the AL?


I don't even think Pedroia is the most valuable on his team.
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Postby JakeYonkel » Fri Nov 07, 2008 12:06 pm

killeverything wrote:It's funny for sure. What the discussion was was Morneau vs. Pedroia for MVP. Now since Morneau's team missed the Playoffs? That leaves him as the biggest choice.


See, I disagree with the notion that a team has to go to the playoffs for a player to win. Besides, the Twins were THIS close. It's not as if they were cellar dwellers all year.

I disagree with the BBWA on damn near everything but keeping juicers out of the Hall. I dislike the fact numbers aren't used for awards. It was for the AL CY last year and I applaud them for it. Jake, you and I have battled long and hard over Pedro should have gotten the MVP for '99. If it wasn't a pitcher, the next obvious canidate was Jeter. Both were fucked. I might be just a TAD biased.....maybe just a little.


Well, either way it was roid-head Pudge. I would be glad to hear an argument for Pedro or Jeter - Pedro was downright DOMINANT that year and Jeter had his best year ever. I just happen to believe that pitchers shouldn't win the MVP, only because the Cy Young is designated solely for them. Otherwise I'd be right there with you.

Who else would be the biggest competition for the AL?


You could make a case for A-Rod, Sizemore, Morneau, MAYBE Teixeira (he was RIDICULOUS with LA - check the #s), Josh Hamilton, hell... even Youkilis. Kinsler, Quentin.

I'm not saying all of them SHOULD be the MVP but you could make a great case for each of them.
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Postby killeverything » Fri Nov 07, 2008 12:07 pm

thejuggernaut wrote:
killeverything wrote:
JakeYonkel wrote:
killeverything wrote:Oh yeah, Pedroia won a Gold Glove! Next it should be MVP.


If he wins the MVP I'm going to laugh really fucking hard.

Check his numbers versus Jeter's numbers in '06 - then Justin Morneau both years, since Morneau is likely to be the sitffest competition either way...


It's funny for sure. What the discussion was was Morneau vs. Pedroia for MVP. Now since Morneau's team missed the Playoffs? That leaves him as the biggest choice.

I disagree with the BBWA on damn near everything but keeping juicers out of the Hall. I dislike the fact numbers aren't used for awards. It was for the AL CY last year and I applaud them for it. Jake, you and I have battled long and hard over Pedro should have gotten the MVP for '99. If it wasn't a pitcher, the next obvious canidate was Jeter. Both were fucked. I might be just a TAD biased.....maybe just a little. Who else would be the biggest competition for the AL?


I don't even think Pedroia is the most valuable on his team.


He's not but for 2008 who is?

Nancy Drew had a monsterous July, Manny was Manny, Papi was hurt, Beckett had an off year, Pappelbon felt the karma of badmouthing Rivera, no Schill, Timlin being 90, Jacoby being exactly what I thought he was over-rated, Lowell hurt.

Who?

I'll leave you with this funny quote from Ozzie Guillen why you ponder that. In light of being told Manny was leaving. "So, I wish Pedroia was leaving".
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Postby thejuggernaut » Sat Nov 08, 2008 1:23 am

killeverything wrote:
thejuggernaut wrote:
killeverything wrote:
JakeYonkel wrote:
killeverything wrote:Oh yeah, Pedroia won a Gold Glove! Next it should be MVP.


If he wins the MVP I'm going to laugh really fucking hard.

Check his numbers versus Jeter's numbers in '06 - then Justin Morneau both years, since Morneau is likely to be the sitffest competition either way...


It's funny for sure. What the discussion was was Morneau vs. Pedroia for MVP. Now since Morneau's team missed the Playoffs? That leaves him as the biggest choice.

I disagree with the BBWA on damn near everything but keeping juicers out of the Hall. I dislike the fact numbers aren't used for awards. It was for the AL CY last year and I applaud them for it. Jake, you and I have battled long and hard over Pedro should have gotten the MVP for '99. If it wasn't a pitcher, the next obvious canidate was Jeter. Both were fucked. I might be just a TAD biased.....maybe just a little. Who else would be the biggest competition for the AL?


I don't even think Pedroia is the most valuable on his team.


He's not but for 2008 who is?

Nancy Drew had a monsterous July, Manny was Manny, Papi was hurt, Beckett had an off year, Pappelbon felt the karma of badmouthing Rivera, no Schill, Timlin being 90, Jacoby being exactly what I thought he was over-rated, Lowell hurt.

Who?

I'll leave you with this funny quote from Ozzie Guillen why you ponder that. In light of being told Manny was leaving. "So, I wish Pedroia was leaving".


Youkilis, hands down.
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Postby killeverything » Sun Nov 09, 2008 2:44 pm

Here is the complete list of Gold Glove winners, my apologies for not posting it earlier.

Can't really argue about any of them. Moose especially. While it's hysterical the MFY missed the playoffs, he certainly had a monsterous year. Humph, and I thought he was done.

P - MIKE MUSSINA - YANKEES
C - JOE MAUER - TWINS
1ST - CARLOS PENA - RAYS
2ND - DUSTIN PEDROIA - RED SOX
3RD - ADRIAN BELTRE - MARINERS
SS - MICHAEL YOUNG - RANGERS
OF - TORII HUNTER - ANGELS
OF - GRADY SIZEMORE - INDIANS
OF - ICHIRO SUZUKI - MARINERS

Here is the list for the NL

P - GREG MADDUX - DODGERS
C - YADIER MOLINA - CARDINALS
1ST - ADRIAN GONZALEZ - PADRES
2ND - BRANDON PHILLIPS - REDS
3RD - DAVID WRIGHT - METS
SS - JIMMY ROLLINS - PHILLIES
OF - NATE MCLOUTH - PIRATES
OF - CARLOS BELTRAN - METS
OF - SHANE VICTORINO - PHILLIES

Can't really argue anyone on that list either, especially Maddux. They're saying he is certain to retire.
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Postby killeverything » Mon Nov 10, 2008 7:48 am

The MFY declined options on Pavano and HGHiambi.

Pettite say's he wants to return to NY, but filed for Free Agency.

Though Andy Pettitte has admitted his designs on pitching next season, there's doubt as to whether or not the Yankees want him back. The only certainty is that if Pettitte wants to pitch elsewhere, he can -- he ensured that much by officially filing for free agency on Sunday. Though Pettitte indicated on Friday that he has "made it perfectly clear" where he wants to play next year, the Yankees have still not contacted either Pettitte or his agent.


It seem like posturing to me. Certainly Andy thinks he can get more somewhere else, and this is obviously a way for Cashman to try to lower his 16m a year.

If I was Cashman, I bring him back. He's a vet that brings a lot to the table. I'm not sure if he's worth 16 anymore, but the leadership can't be denied. Epsecially with the question marks for the rotation. Same as last season basically. Moose is also looking for a 3 year deal. What would you do? I let Moose walk if he will only sign for 3. He can go pitch to Tek somewhere.:D
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