Obama's stimulus spending leads to.....

[VinnieKulick]

A 32 percent INCREASE in bankruptcy filings.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100104/ap_ ... uptcy_boom

Congrats Obama! Thanks for saving the economy.

[pooldude]

I just can't agree with you Vinnie.

Why don't you read your own article that you posted?

"Bankruptcies have been coming in waves, first with those 18 months ago who had adjustable-rate mortages, then with those who lost their jobs due to the housing downturn. Now he's finding wealthy individuals and business owners who have finally succumbed to lower incomes and shrinking home values."

The people who are going bankrupt now are those who are suffering the most from the downturn that officially started in 2007, & had its beginnings even farther back.

You should be thanking Mr Bush & your fellow conservativists for this gift that keeps on giving.

The economy didn't suddenly go to hell because the new administration took over.

[VinnieKulick]

Funny, Obama's spending is credited with "saving" the economy, yet bankruptcies are not his to claim.

Got it!

[pooldude]

Funny, Obama's spending is credited with "saving" the economy, yet bankruptcies are not his to claim.

Got it!

Maybe your understanding of economics isn't as clear cut as you seem to think.

It takes time to change the direction of a global economy for the better, just the same as it takes time for adverse economic conditions to develop in the 1st place.

Without being sarcastic or disrespectful, I think your blanket condemnation of all things Obama is premature.

The previous administration had 8 years to leave us in a mess.

I think Mr Obama's ideas & policies might deserve the benefit of the doubt for @ least a couple years before you declare them absolute failures.

I'm not gloating, nor do I pretend to have all the answers.

But I do have more of a let's wait & see attitude than you guys on the right, who seemingly demand instant results.

[BigDrewHalenite]

Pooldude, I was basically going to say the same thing, but you beat me to it. However, I was also going to add: Vinnie, ya nutsack, your ignorance is showing!

So, there ya go.

[lerxstcat]

The economic crisis was too broad and deep to save everybody in trouble. The aim was to stop a complete collapse a la the Great Depression, and so far that has worked, despite the constant Chicken Little carping of Fox News and the GOP.

One would think they'd RATHER see us have such a Depression, just to get back in power. it's pathological at this point.

Reminds me of the time, while the GOP was impeaching Clinton for denying the Monica thing. Suddenly all the GOP's infidelity scandals started coming out.

Rather than admit, okay, everyone does this to some extent (not literally, but you, know, pachyderms do it, donkeys do it too), they let a number of distinguished GOP legislators fqllm on their swords and resign, simply hoping they could take Bill Clinton down with them. Didn't happen, and the world LOLed at us getting het up over a sex scandal.

Today he's the most popular ex-President alive. Great plan, guys....

[VinnieKulick]

Glad to see Democratic supporters still wanting to say Bill Clinton was impeached for a blowjob, and not for perjury.

[chickenona]

See, I go through this every time we have Democrats in charge who make me less than happy. Before I even get the opportunity to entertain the notion of voting Republican, some crybaby conservative starts a whiny-ass thread like this one and I remember why the right wing sucks so much, much, worse.

Any economic downturn as bad as this last one is going to take time to dig out of, and people don't go bankrupt overnight. I've been in a serious financial tailspin since about late 2006, but I'm only feeling the effects and making serious headway in digging out over the course of the last six months. It takes a while for chickens to come home to roost.

And quit stamping your feet and crying about Clinton. It was two administrations ago, get the fuck over it already.

[VinnieKulick]

Any economic downturn as bad as this last one is going to take time to dig out of, and people don't go bankrupt overnight.

Agreed, however the point of the post was that Obama gets credit for "saving the economy" even though the economy still sucks, and would have come around on it's own, without government spending a ton of money on pork bullshit.
I was trying to point out that when Obama is credited with something happening within a year, people seem to favor it, but when something BAD happens, it's "Oh, it takes years to go bankrupt" which is not always true.

And quit stamping your feet and crying about Clinton. It was two administrations ago, get the fuck over it already.

I didn't bring Clinton up, I was just pointing out that somebody else (wrongly) asserted that the GOP went after him for a blowjob (although it was kenneth Starr, who was appointed by Janet Reno who did it), and not for perjury, which is a felony.

I actually think Clinton did a fair job as President, eliminating welfare rolls and getting rid of a lot of waste in government (although a lot of it was due to the BRAC commision military drawdown that GHWB initiated).

[HollywoodBomb]

They want to destroy the economy to keep the population under control.

[pooldude]

They want to destroy the economy to keep the population under control.

C'mon...we shouldn't go that far in describing the last Republican administration...

[lerxstcat]

Glad to see Democratic supporters still wanting to say Bill Clinton was impeached for a blowjob, and not for perjury.

I believe I DID say he was impeached for denying it, but that whole kangaroo court event was simply the culmination of 8 years of chasing nothing on the GOP's part. He served his full 2 terms and is the ost popular ex-President living. Those are facts.

The money the GOP legislators spent chasing shadows for those 8 years could have been spent in much better ways to benefit the nation. But fuck the peasants, right?

[JakeYonkel]

The money the GOP legislators spent chasing shadows for those 8 years could have been spent in much better ways to benefit the nation. But fuck the peasants, right?

Sure, but every administration wastes money. I'd like to think the $650 million set aside for fucking digital converter boxes could have been spent better.

[VinnieKulick]

Glad to see Democratic supporters still wanting to say Bill Clinton was impeached for a blowjob, and not for perjury.

I believe I DID say he was impeached for denying it, but that whole kangaroo court event was simply the culmination of 8 years of chasing nothing on the GOP's part. He served his full 2 terms and is the ost popular ex-President living. Those are facts.

The money the GOP legislators spent chasing shadows for those 8 years could have been spent in much better ways to benefit the nation. But fuck the peasants, right?

The GOP wasn't chasing him. Kenneth Starr was. Kenneth Starr, the independent council, appointed by Janet Reno, who could have removed him from the post at any time during the investigation. But, it sounds better to say it was the GOP.
And, what does his popularity mean? Why is that relevant? Marion Barry was a crackhead and was reelected, does that make him a good person?

[VinnieKulick]

Vinnie, stop talking about the economy. You don't have a clue what's going on. You're complaining about the stimulus spending when the spending portion was put off to 2010 (the election year). The 2009 portion was mostly tax cuts and aid to the states. You're complaining about the ineffectiveness of tax cuts but you're too stupid to realize it.

Oh, the tax rebate? the one that gave people like $25 extra dollars a month? Yeah, that will certainly stimulate the economy. Even the Obama supporters I knew were saying how silly that idea was. Not only did he take money out of the treasury, but the people who got the rebate will be closer to the next highest tax bracket because of it. So, he really did nobody any favors.

[lerxstcat]

Glad to see Democratic supporters still wanting to say Bill Clinton was impeached for a blowjob, and not for perjury.

I believe I DID say he was impeached for denying it, but that whole kangaroo court event was simply the culmination of 8 years of chasing nothing on the GOP's part. He served his full 2 terms and is the ost popular ex-President living. Those are facts.

The money the GOP legislators spent chasing shadows for those 8 years could have been spent in much better ways to benefit the nation. But fuck the peasants, right?

The GOP wasn't chasing him. Kenneth Starr was. Kenneth Starr, the independent council, appointed by Janet Reno, who could have removed him from the post at any time during the investigation. But, it sounds better to say it was the GOP.
And, what does his popularity mean? Why is that relevant? Marion Barry was a crackhead and was reelected, does that make him a good person?

That's independent "counsel" in this usage. And is Ken Starr a Democrat, or is he a Republican? Are you really trying to say that the GOP was not the motive force behind that sick witchhunt?

Sure, Reno could have fired him - and the GOP members of Congress would have impeached based on that action. Wasn't a real option if the object was to not be impeached.

[VinnieKulick]

I don't know, or care what party he belonged to, the fact is, he was appointed by a Democratic's Attorney General. The same AG who could have removed him at any time,but refused to do so. Why? perhaps the AG was actually doing what the head of the justice department was supposed to do, and INVESTIGATE CRIMES.

And, the GOP couldn't impeach Clinton because somebody was removed. They needed some type of proof, or a good case to do so.

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

I don't know, or care what party he belonged to, the fact is, he was appointed by a Democratic's Attorney General. The same AG who could have removed him at any time,but refused to do so. Why? perhaps the AG was actually doing what the head of the justice department was supposed to do, and INVESTIGATE CRIMES.

And, the GOP couldn't impeach Clinton because somebody was removed. They needed some type of proof, or a good case to do so.

The Attorney General is the head of the Department of Justice. Your ignorance truly has no bounds.

[Ugmo]

More self clownage by Vinnie Kulick.

My kingdom for a conservative War Boarder who doesn't clown himself at every opportunity.

[VinnieKulick]

Self Ownage?

Try some reading comprehension.

I asked why the AG didnt remove him?
He was working FOR the AG.
He was investigating crimes FOR the AG.

And still, you all say it's the GOP who was after him. It was Clinton's AG who had the integrity to see it through.

[bane]

Self Ownage?

Try some reading comprehension.

I asked why the AG didnt remove him?
He was working FOR the AG.
He was investigating crimes FOR the AG.

And still, you all say it's the GOP who was after him. It was Clinton's AG who had the integrity to see it through.

That's just ridiculous. Newt Gingrich was on TV every night screaming from the rafters for Clinton's impeachment. That witch hunt had the GOP's greasy fingers all over it. The investigation was supposed to be about Whitewater, and when they couldn't find anything they went with the blowjob scandal and ran with it. Starr was doing his job, as was Reno, but the GOP are the ones who blew it all out of proportion. That's readily apparent to anyone without partisan blinders. That was one of the more disgusting episodes in American political history if you ask me.

[VinnieKulick]

Did the GOP want Bill impeached? Yes.
Should he have been impeached for perjury? Yes.

Did Janet Reno have the power to end the witch hunt? Yes.

It was an horrible scenario for America.
It made us launch missles that we didn't need to.
It cost taxpayers a assload of money.

But, in the end, Clinton lied under oath, and should have been held accountable, which he was. He was tried per our rules, and I have no problem with that.

[bane]

He should never have been asked the question under oath to begin with.

[VinnieKulick]

He should never have been asked the question under oath to begin with.

Agreed.
But does that make the perjury go away?

And, as a lawyer, you would think he would just "5th amendment" himself out of the situation.

[pooldude]

It made us launch missles that we didn't need to.

Didn't we just have a thread with the right wingers complaining about how Clinton dropped the ball for not taking out Bin Laden?

Vinnie says Bill Clinton launched missiles we didn't need to.

Yet another right winger, EvilMadman says exactly the opposite:

There is NO WAY Democrats can attack Republicans for not doing anything to stop Al-Qaeda because they (Democrats) weren't aware there was a serious threat from Al-Qaeda before the USS Cole and the 9-11 attacks. The Clinton administration basically fumbled chance after chance to capture, or more likely assassinate OBL, and Bill Clinton just couldn't bring himself to pull the trigger when he had the chance.

Talk about damned if ya do, & damned if ya don't.

You boys better get your Limbaugh-isms straight!

[bane]

He should never have been asked the question under oath to begin with.

Agreed.
But does that make the perjury go away?

And, as a lawyer, you would think he would just "5th amendment" himself out of the situation.

No, it doesn't. It never should have gotten to that point, but he did commit perjury so the impeachment was valid, but come on man, what man wouldn't lie about that? I know I would have. The 5th doesn't help him any with his wife.

[VinnieKulick]

This may come as a surprise to you pooldude, but not everybody who disagrees with the President who's the furthest left of anybody we've ever put in office, is automatically a Right Winger.

I don't think we needed to bomb an aspirin factory.

I DO think we should have taken him when he was offered by the Sudanese government, since we can be damn sure there won't be another government EVER to offer him to us, unless he's silly enough to go to Germany or England.

[VinnieKulick]

Bane, do you really think after Gennifer Flowers and all the other rumored affairs, that Monica was going to be the downfall of Bill's marriage?

Hillary was/is in it for power, nothing more, nothing less.

[lerxstcat]

He should never have been asked the question under oath to begin with.

Agreed.
But does that make the perjury go away?

And, as a lawyer, you would think he would just "5th amendment" himself out of the situation.

No, it doesn't. It never should have gotten to that point, but he did commit perjury so the impeachment was valid, but come on man, what man wouldn't lie about that? I know I would have. The 5th doesn't help him any with his wife.

Lying under oath about infidelity to your wife should be an accepted corollary to the Fifth Amendment, since taking the Fifth in that situation outs you to your wife anyway. Just as a spouse can't be compelled to testify against a spouse, it should be understood that you shouldn't have to say anything that would fuck up your marriage.

8 years of trumped up bullshit led to a situation where they could impeach based on the President refusing to incriminate himself in his wife's eyes. Fucking ridiculous and all Republicans should be ashamed of that sordid 8-year-long witchhunt.

[bane]

Bane, do you really think after Gennifer Flowers and all the other rumored affairs, that Monica was going to be the downfall of Bill's marriage?

Hillary was/is in it for power, nothing more, nothing less.

I don't know, but come on, it was public. Whether she knew or not, she didn't need their dirty laundry aired where the entire world could see it. Bill lied because he thought he'd get away with it. I'm sure that in hindsight he regrets it, but only knowing what he knew then, I'd have done the exact same thing. So would most men I'd wager.