Alice Cooper is playing high school gyms now?

[DemonFilth2001]

No one outside of this forum is jonesing for Tony Martin.

Hell, not even Sludge wants that. This is the place to pine for a Born Again era tour though!

My 3rd favorite Sabbath album!

[BernieTaupson]

They could have easily done a Born Again thing ten years ago after Dio died. Keep the cycle going. They did do that Who Cares? charity song with Iommi/Gillan/McBrain. Think Newstead was on it too?

[KISStian]

They could have easily done a Born Again thing ten years ago after Dio died. Keep the cycle going. They did do that Who Cares? charity song with Iommi/Gillan/McBrain. Think Newstead was on it too?

I don't think "easily" is the right adverb. I doubt there was ever any interest from Ian Gillan. For one, he couldn't hit those notes and for two, why?

[Bono Nettencourt]

As good as the record was, the Born Again tour was a legendary disaster that served as a tableau for Spinal Tap and a catalyst for a DP MK II reunion.

[Ozzy Stradlin]

If you pay his guarantee, he will play in your living room.

[Love_Industry]

As good as the record was, the Born Again tour was a legendary disaster that served as a tableau for Spinal Tap and a catalyst for a DP MK II reunion.

Some sources say the DP reunion was already a go when Gillan signed up for Sabbath. Gillan and Paice had to wait for the others to finish up with Rainbow and Whitesnake so Gillan signed up for one album and tour with Sabbath. Without telling Iommi and Geezer of course.

[KISStian]

As good as the record was, the Born Again tour was a legendary disaster that served as a tableau for Spinal Tap and a catalyst for a DP MK II reunion.

Some sources say the DP reunion was already a go when Gillan signed up for Sabbath. Gillan and Paice had to wait for the others to finish up with Rainbow and Whitesnake so Gillan signed up for one album and tour with Sabbath. Without telling Iommi and Geezer of course.

That's hysterical if true. People forget that the DP reunion was either the biggest or second biggest tour of that year.

[KISStian]

As good as the record was, the Born Again tour was a legendary disaster that served as a tableau for Spinal Tap and a catalyst for a DP MK II reunion.

Is that record really "good" or just in "so bad it's good territory?" Lets not forget, it was the first Sabbath album to not even go Gold. It only hit number 39. This was at the height of NWOBHM supremacy. I enjoy the shit out of the album, for fun. It gets praise around here but this also the place where Ultraphobic, MC94, and Native Tongue are considered some kind of Holy Trinity.

[Bono Nettencourt]

Well once you get to singer #3, the fans usually split if they didn't by #2. See also Van Halen.

The tour certainly didn't help sales. People also bag on the mix, but I kinda like it. Despite its flaws, It's certainly much better than anything that followed.

[Ozzy Stradlin]

As good as the record was, the Born Again tour was a legendary disaster that served as a tableau for Spinal Tap and a catalyst for a DP MK II reunion.

Is that record really "good" or just in "so bad it's good territory?" Lets not forget, it was the first Sabbath album to not even go Gold. It only hit number 39. This was at the height of NWOBHM supremacy. I enjoy the shit out of the album, for fun. It gets praise around here but this also the place where Ultraphobic, MC94, and Native Tongue are considered some kind of Holy Trinity.

“Trashed” is a decent song:

https://youtu.be/Zn9ykBw5U2A?si=uO9dik-AkklrH0oo

[DemonFilth2001]

As good as the record was, the Born Again tour was a legendary disaster that served as a tableau for Spinal Tap and a catalyst for a DP MK II reunion.

Is that record really "good" or just in "so bad it's good territory?" Lets not forget, it was the first Sabbath album to not even go Gold. It only hit number 39. This was at the height of NWOBHM supremacy. I enjoy the shit out of the album, for fun. It gets praise around here but this also the place where Ultraphobic, MC94, and Native Tongue are considered some kind of Holy Trinity.

That’s NOT the Holy Trinity.

[KISStian]

If you pay his guarantee, he will play in your living room.

That's true and I've never really seen a guy work the map like Shep. I'm in Ohio. Alice will come through and play our "A Markets," which are Columbus, Cincinnati, and Cleveland. Those shows are often in packages, like with Rob Zombie or maybe opening for Crue/Leppard, etc. Then, he'll come through and play the B-Markets, which are still sizable towns with decent venues. Places like Dayton, Toledo, Akron, and Youngstown. These places used to get a ton of shows back in the days of bands playing 180 shows per year to sell albums but don't get near the amount of shows they used to since albums died and Live Nation took over the business. But, Alice doesn't stop there. Because he can make his theatrics work in relatively small theatre type set ups, he'll come through Ohio and play places like Sandusky, Warren, Lima and Troy. It's really something. And he gets something like $75k+ each night for this gig.

[KISStian]

Well once you get to singer #3, the fans usually split if they didn't by #2. See also Van Halen.

The tour certainly didn't help sales. People also bag on the mix, but I kinda like it. Despite its flaws, It's certainly much better than anything that followed.

You'll get no argument from me. IMHO, Sabbath pretty much stops at Born Again only briefly to return for Dehumanizer. I have no use for any of the TM stuff, the H&H 09 album, or 13. None at all. The debut through BA is a rather amazing run as it stands.

[Bono Nettencourt]

As good as the record was, the Born Again tour was a legendary disaster that served as a tableau for Spinal Tap and a catalyst for a DP MK II reunion.

Is that record really "good" or just in "so bad it's good territory?" Lets not forget, it was the first Sabbath album to not even go Gold. It only hit number 39. This was at the height of NWOBHM supremacy. I enjoy the shit out of the album, for fun. It gets praise around here but this also the place where Ultraphobic, MC94, and Native Tongue are considered some kind of Holy Trinity.

That’s NOT the Holy Trinity.

Right. Friggin' piker.

[BernieTaupson]

As good as the record was, the Born Again tour was a legendary disaster that served as a tableau for Spinal Tap and a catalyst for a DP MK II reunion.

How was it a disaster? Silly stage prop aside. Which wasn’t even a big deal, they just didn’t use the mammoth bits and used the smaller ones, which got into most venues. They did nearly 100 shows.

The Seventh Star tour was more of a disaster - vocalist couldn’t sing, they brought in Ray Gillen and hid him from Glenn Hughes for a few days so he could watch the show a couple of times, Glenn found out and was going to pummel Iommi who hid from him, then attendance was so bad the second half of the tour got shitcanned anyway. About twenty shows tops.

Same with the Eternal Idol tour. Around twenty shows before it fizzled out.

[Whatever Happened To…]

Pretty bold move of Alice to start the show with a very deep cut from Raise Your Fist, he's good at throwing the long-term fans a bone. I've seen him a few times and there's always been a cool rarity in the set like Pain or Clones, it's always worth going to see him.

Be a sad day when Alice isn't on the road any more.

[Bono Nettencourt]

As good as the record was, the Born Again tour was a legendary disaster that served as a tableau for Spinal Tap and a catalyst for a DP MK II reunion.

How was it a disaster? Silly stage prop aside. Which wasn’t even a big deal, they just didn’t use the mammoth bits and used the smaller ones, which got into most venues. They did nearly 100 shows.

Gillan didn't really learn/try on the old stuff, he admits was onstage with a lyric sheet that he couldn't read because of the fog. Ofc it got even worse after, 7th Star was like Spinal Tap x1000.

[BernieTaupson]

Best version of Black Sabbath song ever was with Gillan.

https://youtu.be/wI6qFt2QRXk?si=_eX2F-BrK_Vr2DXC

[KISStian]

Pretty bold move of Alice to start the show with a very deep cut from Raise Your Fist, he's good at throwing the long-term fans a bone. I've seen him a few times and there's always been a cool rarity in the set like Pain or Clones, it's always worth going to see him.

Be a sad day when Alice isn't on the road any more.

I love it, but knowing that it's a deep cut that next to no one in the crowd is going to know, he only goes to the first chorus, so that's a bummer.

[Tommy2Tone84]

I don’t understand the whole ‘make fun of an act cause they don’t sell out every show like Taylor swift’ mentality.

no one can stay anywhere near the top for very long, and this current climate is complete dogshit

Especially from grown men posting on a hair metal forum in 2024.

I am not a huge Alice fan (nothing against him I'm just not super familiar with his catalog), but the guy is an iconic part of rock and roll and has been playing rock music successfully since 1968 and someone is going to snap a photo of a show audience they paid to see and then post it to a message board to attempt to make fun of the guy because its not a sold out stadium? Ok...

I wouldn’t call the Alice Cooper Band “successful” in 1968. They were actively working at the time. But successful? Success for them didn’t come until 1971’s Love It To Death. They had about a three year run until Alice and Shep broke the original band up in 1974-75 so Alice could go solo. Which he’s had very mixed results with. He’s got nothing on Ozzy as far as sales or quality go.

Alice fans love to splooge over him but I’ve found his career to be very uneven and mediocre. His original band was never as good, successful or groundbreaking as The Who, Stones, Beatles, Zeppelin, Sabbath, Pink Floyd, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Elton John, Aerosmith, and even AC/DC, Van Halen and Metallica. While I’m sure many of his fans would love to punch me for saying this, he has far more in common with KISS as far as career trajectory and sales go than he does with those in the upper pantheon of rock music.

[BernieTaupson]

Yeah, I like the Coop but let’s be honest he’s never had a great album. Even Nightmare and the OG band albums like School’s Out have a load of shit on them.

Great stagecraft, great gimmick, good bands over the years, I respect the hell out of the guy for shaking it up every tour and bringing back some rare stuff, but what was the last album he did that was worth listening to more than once?

Dragontown probably? 2001.

[KISStian]

I don’t understand the whole ‘make fun of an act cause they don’t sell out every show like Taylor swift’ mentality.

no one can stay anywhere near the top for very long, and this current climate is complete dogshit

Especially from grown men posting on a hair metal forum in 2024.

I am not a huge Alice fan (nothing against him I'm just not super familiar with his catalog), but the guy is an iconic part of rock and roll and has been playing rock music successfully since 1968 and someone is going to snap a photo of a show audience they paid to see and then post it to a message board to attempt to make fun of the guy because its not a sold out stadium? Ok...

I wouldn’t call the Alice Cooper Band “successful” in 1968. They were actively working at the time. But successful? Success for them didn’t come until 1971’s Love It To Death. They had about a three year run until Alice and Shep broke the original band up in 1974-75 so Alice could go solo. Which he’s had very mixed results with. He’s got nothing on Ozzy as far as sales or quality go.

Alice fans love to splooge over him but I’ve found his career to be very uneven and mediocre. His original band was never as good, successful or groundbreaking as The Who, Stones, Beatles, Zeppelin, Sabbath, Pink Floyd, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Elton John, Aerosmith, and even AC/DC, Van Halen and Metallica. While I’m sure many of his fans would love to punch me for saying this, he has far more in common with KISS as far as career trajectory and sales go than he does with those in the upper pantheon of rock music.

I love Alice but would agree with everything except that jab at Alice in comparison to Ozzy. Take Sharon, Kerslake, Daisley and Rhoads away from Ozzy and what do you have? And with those two, you still only have the 2 albums. Imagine if Ozzy's solo output was Bark-whatever the hell the last one was? There's maybe one good album in there? Ozzy is the most overrated person in hard rock. Easy.

[KISStian]

Yeah, I like the Coop but let’s be honest he’s never had a great album. Even Nightmare and the OG band albums like School’s Out have a load of shit on them.

Great stagecraft, great gimmick, good bands over the years, I respect the hell out of the guy for shaking it up every tour and bringing back some rare stuff, but what was the last album he did that was worth listening to more than once?

Dragontown probably? 2001.

True, the albums have sucked for a long time. I don't even know why he bothers at this point. I can see where someone doesn't dig every track on SO or WTMN but I'd also have to say that those are albums I can listen to track-by-track back-to-back and love every tune. The first Cooper album where I start skipping tunes is L&W (sans the first two Zappa albums, but I don't really count those.) I'd give Cooper credit for a good run from the ACG era LitD - GtH and then nice little ending of the original solo run with FtI thru the Wierd 4. I might even throw in the two MCA albums. The Epic albums through the modern stuff does nothing for me though. Being totally honest.

[Love_Industry]

Yeah, I like the Coop but let’s be honest he’s never had a great album. Even Nightmare and the OG band albums like School’s Out have a load of shit on them.

Great stagecraft, great gimmick, good bands over the years, I respect the hell out of the guy for shaking it up every tour and bringing back some rare stuff, but what was the last album he did that was worth listening to more than once?

Dragontown probably? 2001.

Paranormal is a really good album and has the OG band on a couple of songs.

[KISStian]

Yeah, I like the Coop but let’s be honest he’s never had a great album. Even Nightmare and the OG band albums like School’s Out have a load of shit on them.

Great stagecraft, great gimmick, good bands over the years, I respect the hell out of the guy for shaking it up every tour and bringing back some rare stuff, but what was the last album he did that was worth listening to more than once?

Dragontown probably? 2001.

Paranormal is a really good album and has the OG band on a couple of songs.

I didn't hate it but it just wasn't memorable. I don't see me every revisiting it. That's how I've felt about all of them. I used to get the promos up until Dirty Diamonds. Now, with Spotify (or whichever you use) I can listen to an album without having to purchase and it's a wonderful thing. Despite what everyone says on here!

[BernieTaupson]

Yeah, he’s never done a “bad” album, they’re just totally disposable. I listen to the new ones when they come out but two weeks later can’t remember a single song from them. He will play a couple new songs live on the tour and then act like they don’t exist either. What was the last song he put back into a setlist from a “recent” album? Steal That Car from Dirty Diamonds (I think) springs to mind, I don’t think he’s even revisited anything from Nightmare2 and that was a reasonably high profile release at the time …

[VicStelly]

Dirty Diamonds is a great record. I have skipped the newer releases for some reason.