Metal Sludge Gossip Board

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 10:25 am**

"one of the best albums of all time..."

Holy fucking christ.
This is like a thread of the head injured.

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 10:35 am**

I’d stop short of brilliant, myself, but definitely very good, and light years better than Bark at the Moon.

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 11:41 am**

sicktwistedfreak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 2:49 am
HottKarl777 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 19, 2024 9:10 pm Fuck yeah it is. Jake's rhythm playing is unbelievably creative. Unfortunately its hard to hear everything he's doing with the mix. I went on You Tube and found some dude playing "Never" and when you see and hear all the little things Jake is doing it is fucking mind boggling how cool it is.

There weren't too many shredders that threw down on busy rhythm parts that hard and went past power chords into EVH inspired chord inversions. Jake studied piano like Ed so his brain is way more musical than your average dipshit blues box guitar player.
This one?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hS7x2R6aqAs

Damn, so cool to hear all the intricacies that are missing from the album mix. I’ve always loved both the Jake era CD’s and I know this will be considered blasphemy but I like his playing better than Randy.

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 2:28 pm**

BernieTaupson wrote: ↑Fri Apr 19, 2024 4:10 pm Some good songs and great playing let down by the mix sounding like shit, and not enough variety in the tunes.

A bunch of them are pretty much just the same song. Never, Never Know Why, Lightning Strikes, Fool Like You … how many mid tempo rockers did they need?

Yeah, they didn't even try there. So much filler and more obvious than on both Bark and No Rest. Add to that crap lyrics on half the album, I mean "You never know why we rock, we rock"... "Rockin all night until the Lightning Strikes again" ... $haron PAID someone to write that?

But Killer of Giants, Secret Loser and SitD are great.

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:02 pm**

I celebrate both the Randy and Jake albums as "classic Ozzy."

Ozzy's success with Zakk speaks for itself, and NMT is a great album, but it was a different vibe. Ozzy was trying to become more respectable and choke out his wife less. The music suffered.

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:39 pm**

There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 4:30 pm**

WCiezak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:39 pm There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.

Blizzard is not over-rated, and it has nothing to do with your age range. It's always the songwriting, and the songs on Blizzard are better than those on the albums Jake played on, or anything past that.

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 6:44 pm**

DrumminAway wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 11:41 am I know this will be considered blasphemy but I like his playing better than Randy.

Not blasphemy. Totally agreed. I always liked Jake better than Randy.

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 7:41 pm**

You just need to get past the production and the songs will eventually click.

Posted: **Sat Apr 20, 2024 8:10 pm**

sicktwistedfreak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 2:49 am
HottKarl777 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 19, 2024 9:10 pm Fuck yeah it is. Jake's rhythm playing is unbelievably creative. Unfortunately its hard to hear everything he's doing with the mix. I went on You Tube and found some dude playing "Never" and when you see and hear all the little things Jake is doing it is fucking mind boggling how cool it is.

There weren't too many shredders that threw down on busy rhythm parts that hard and went past power chords into EVH inspired chord inversions. Jake studied piano like Ed so his brain is way more musical than your average dipshit blues box guitar player.
This one?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hS7x2R6aqAs

Yep thats the one. He even has a powder blue guitar that looks like the Charvel Jake used at the US Festival. This guy on the video is REALLY fucking good at playing Jakes stuff. I wish he would do the whole album. There is another kid on You Tube that did all the solos for Blizzard, Diary, Bark, and Ultimate and he just nails them. He made me realize just how great Jake was when you see the licks being played that fast and how melodic his lines are.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 4:10 am**

Dude even nails Jake's tone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-rtVn9mGvQ

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 5:14 am**

Dyslexicheart wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 4:30 pm
WCiezak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:39 pm There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.
Blizzard is not over-rated, and it has nothing to do with your age range. It's always the songwriting, and the songs on Blizzard are better than those on the albums Jake played on, or anything past that.

Blizzard is overated. Goodbye To Romance is terrible, worse than Dreamer. No Bone Movies is terrible. Diary is great front to back.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 6:43 am**

Ziggy Sawdust wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 5:14 am
Dyslexicheart wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 4:30 pm
WCiezak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:39 pm There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.
Blizzard is not over-rated, and it has nothing to do with your age range. It's always the songwriting, and the songs on Blizzard are better than those on the albums Jake played on, or anything past that.

Blizzard is overated. Goodbye To Romance is terrible, worse than Dreamer. No Bone Movies is terrible. Diary is great front to back.

Blizzard is indeed one of the most overrated metal albums of all time.

Never understood the hype for it.

The only good part of crazy train is the intro.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 7:30 am**

pieceofme wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 6:43 amBlizzard is indeed one of the most overrated metal albums of all time.

Never understood the hype for it.

The only good part of crazy train is the intro.

This is OUTRAGEOUS nonsense.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:50 am**

Chip Z'Hoy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 7:30 am
pieceofme wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 6:43 amBlizzard is indeed one of the most overrated metal albums of all time.

Never understood the hype for it.

The only good part of crazy train is the intro.
This is OUTRAGEOUS nonsense.

Agreed.

But another vote for Goodbye to Romance sucking. I'll take any of his other ballads over this turd, including So Tired and Dreamer.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 12:40 pm**

Ziggy Sawdust wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 5:14 am
Dyslexicheart wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 4:30 pm
WCiezak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:39 pm There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.
Blizzard is not over-rated, and it has nothing to do with your age range. It's always the songwriting, and the songs on Blizzard are better than those on the albums Jake played on, or anything past that.

Blizzard is overated. Goodbye To Romance is terrible, worse than Dreamer. No Bone Movies is terrible. Diary is great front to back.

I agree that Diary is great front to back, better than Blizzard. But Blizzard is not overrated in my opinion. it was different than anything that came out before, a modern-day Sabbath.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 1:10 pm**

"Diary" > "Blizzard" - the mix on "Blizzard" has always seemed a bit "thin" to me, whereas "Diary" has a lot of bottom end and heft.

I feel the same way about "The Ultimate Sin" - thin. but the album as a whole is great. producer Ron Nevison was in high demand for a few years, he produced quite a few albums then - Heart, KISS, Europe, Vince Neil.

I remember that time in my life pretty vividly thanks to this album. "Shot In The Dark" was all over MTV, the genre was going strong. life was simpler back then.

good times.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 1:57 pm**

"Shot in the Dark" was the first I'd ever heard or seen Ozzy. So I thought that's just what Ozzy looked like--a crying old lady.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 1:58 pm**

For me, Blizzard and Diary are about 4 or 5 songs:

I Don't Know
Crazy Train
Goodbye To Romance
Suicide Solution
Mr. Crowley

Diary:

Over The Mountain
Flying High Again
You Can't Kill Rock N Roll
SATO
Diary of A Madman

Crazy Train is stronger than anything on Diary, but you remove it and Diary is a far stronger selection of songs. I'll take Secret Loser and Shot in the Dark over anything from Blizzard and Diary. Bark sounds like the songs are being played a bit too slow. It sounds like a very casual album. Ultimate Sin is pretty easy for me to listen to from beginning to end. I just enjoy it more than the others. And yes, Trunkers do overrate everything that was released when they were in high school. They're the type of fan who thinks Defenders of the Faith is a big letdown.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 2:18 pm**

I remember dating a girl in the early 2000's who used to work for Sharon and she told me the first task she was assigned was to scrub all the pics of Ozzy with Jake like that era never existed. To me Jake saved Ozzy at that time as he was the perfect replacement for him, what a way to thank him, such a cunt.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm**

What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 6:03 pm**

Nobody wrote shit like Jake back then. This guy does a great lesson on the Lightning Strikes solo, and I never realized how awesome it was until I saw this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nY2Ct-erU6I&t=10s

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 8:16 pm**

Thrasherfan17 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 6:03 pm Nobody wrote shit like Jake back then. This guy does a great lesson on the Lightning Strikes solo, and I never realized how awesome it was until I saw this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nY2Ct-erU6I&t=10s

Yeah man that is exactly what I'm talking about. Jake would put major key chords in these heavy songs to solo over and he did it beautifully like EVH and Vito Bratta. These guys were composing from their hearts and brains and not just regurgitating pentatonic licks real fast.

Posted: **Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pm**

Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?

Jake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.

Posted: **Mon Apr 22, 2024 5:36 am**

aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pm
Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
Jake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.

shit, she even held a grudge against Carmine Appice for little to no reason:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCNz7Myklrs

Posted: **Mon Apr 22, 2024 1:20 pm**

veritas wrote: ↑Mon Apr 22, 2024 5:36 am
aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pm
Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
Jake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.
shit, she even held a grudge against Carmine Appice for little to no reason:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCNz7Myklrs

That situation was even nastier because Carmine was already a big name when he joined Ozzy.

Sharon's mindset from day 1 is that Ozzy is the only reason there's any albums and tickets being sold. Everyone else is replaceable, so simply giving someone the opportunity to be in Ozzy's band is already more than they're worth. Therefore, anyone who isn't happy with whatever they give them beyond that is an ungrateful troublemaker.

And of course, she has a point to some degree but the level to which she's disrespected/fucked over/been a shady royal cunt is next level indefensible.

And yes, Wendy Dio was the same way. And in both cases neither Ozzy nor Dio had the balls to stand up to them.

So when Carmine joined, him simply being a "name" already made him a "threat' in her eyes. Making money on the side with drum clinics? You're an asshole!

Posted: **Mon Apr 22, 2024 1:23 pm**

aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pm
Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
Jake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.

Never understood her holding a grudge since he was fired. Does Hakk have any songwriters credit?

Posted: **Mon Apr 22, 2024 1:28 pm**

Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Mon Apr 22, 2024 1:23 pm
aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pm
Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
Jake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.
Never understood her holding a grudge since he was fired. Does Hakk have any songwriters credit?

Posted: **Mon Apr 22, 2024 2:16 pm**

Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Mon Apr 22, 2024 1:23 pm
aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pm
Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
Jake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.
Never understood her holding a grudge since he was fired. Does Hakk have any songwriters credit?

In her mind, she's just pissed that Jake put his foot down and refused to do Ultimate Sin without credits ahead of time (which is how they fucked him on Bark At The Moon). She's the kind of cunt who would never let that go, because it wasn't on "her terms".

Zakk has had extensive credits on all of the albums since he joined the band. I've never heard any whispers of any beef with him and Ozzy or Sharon, or if he had to fight for credits in any way.

It's possible that her attitude had shifted by the Zakk era. Without knowing much else, my very gut instinct is that by that time Sharon saw enough zeros in the bank account that she could turn the "cutthroat cunt" dial down a bit. But just a bit.

Posted: **Mon Apr 22, 2024 3:29 pm**

He was also a 20-yo kid from Jersey who was just happy to be there, so I'm sure he was more amenable to keeping quiet and doing whatever he was told.

Metal Sludge Gossip Board

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