Killeverything's (New)NeverEndingBaseballThread

[killeverything]

http://mfile.akamai.com/24715/wmv/yes.d ... es_800.wmv

Look at the reaction in Teixiera's face as he tours the new Yankee Stadium. It's the kind of reaction a kid has when he goes to Disneyland/world for the 1st time.

Every just signed Free Agents are going to say/act like that. Especially after given 180 million ( see: HGHiambi ). You could say "Killeverything sucks", and if you gave me a 100 million dollars, I'd agree with you. With Teix though, he seems like a Yankee to me. It's more of a "fit" persay. I'm just sayin'.

For Jake and Machado. If Pavano is healthy enough to pitch.....the one time a year he is. I hope it's against NY. There is so much bad blood against him, and he to them. It should be a hell of game. Like if he "came inside" a guy that would never charge the mound, like let's say Jeter. I could see him charging the mound. I gotta make sure I don't miss that game.

Baseball Gods, let this match-up happen. Please. Don't fuck us out of it.....like you did with seeing Schilling vs. Johnson. I was so looking forward to that one. I had tix to the game I thought it would be and everything. Fuck.

[Machado]

I don't know the exact date, but the indians are schedule to face
the Yankees sometime in the 1st month of the season.

So yeah, depending on if pavano is healthy and in the rotation, it would be marvelous for him
to toe the rubber against us.
I don't care if the game is in The Bronx or in cleveland. Well I do care because if the game
were at The Bronx, the amount of cheers would be multiplied by about 10.

pavano does not have the balls to throw at Jeter. are you kidding? who do you think he is, a man full of guts?


P.S. I see the red sox are leaning on 2 pitcher's with shoulder/arm trouble.
I see the baseball gods are smiling down on my Yankees in '09

[killeverything]

This is from the Hungwell Appreciation Thread, but I thought it belonged here.



Fucking great mang!

[Sabu]

Mets are bringing in Tim Redding...

Eh... I guess there are a lot worse #5's out there, but the Mets are REALLY going to have to hope that Pelfrey is ready to be a #2 if they can't land Lowe.

As much of an enigma as he is, I really hope the bring Ollie back. The guy can drive you bat shit with some of his outings, but really tends to turn it up in a big game.

His numbers against the Yanks and Phils last year:

Yanks: 14.2 innings / 6 Hits / 3 Earned Runs / 12 Ks / 2 BBs
Phils: 26 innings / 17 hits / 1 Earned Run / 27 Ks / 11 BBs

Didn't allow a run in three of his last four starts down the stretch. The "Ollie Nights" aside... he's a pretty solid #3, and he's a lefty.

With the success he's had against the Yanks the last two years, I was kind of surprised the Sox didn't make a run at him.

[killeverything]

Mets are bringing in Tim Redding...

Eh... I guess there are a lot worse #5's out there, but the Mets are REALLY going to have to hope that Pelfrey is ready to be a #2 if they can't land Lowe.

As much of an enigma as he is, I really hope the bring Ollie back. The guy can drive you bat shit with some of his outings, but really tends to turn it up in a big game.

His numbers against the Yanks and Phils last year:

Yanks: 14.2 innings / 6 Hits / 3 Earned Runs / 12 Ks / 2 BBs
Phils: 26 innings / 17 hits / 1 Earned Run / 27 Ks / 11 BBs

Didn't allow a run in three of his last four starts down the stretch. The "Ollie Nights" aside... he's a pretty solid #3, and he's a lefty.

With the success he's had against the Yanks the last two years, I was kind of surprised the Sox didn't make a run at him.

Nah, and probably for the same reason the MFY didn't try to get Rodrigo Lopez ( ERA+77 in 2005 ), who absolutely killed Boston. Read the chapter "Why Certain Pitchers Don't Own A Line-up And Vice Versa' by Baseball Prospectus, to get a better idea.

I would be concerned with Lowe if I was you. Without him I don't know what the Mets would do. He's managed by Scott Boras, so a reasonable contract is out of the picture. Do you think Pedro will return? What to do about that? Someone needs to tell K Rod that the Phillies are still the team to beat.

[Sabu]

Nah, and probably for the same reason the MFY didn't try to get Rodrigo Lopez ( ERA+77 in 2005 ), who absolutely killed Boston. Read the chapter "Why Certain Pitchers Don't Own A Line-up And Vice Versa' by Baseball Prospectus, to get a better idea.

I don't think it's the line-up or the team... I just think he thrives on that type of atmosphere. Outside of Philly and the Yanks last year, he really didn't pitch in any of those "big fight" type environments... but when he did, the guy brought his stuff (Game 7 vs. the Cards). He's just a guy in those types of environments that can bring it as well as anyone. Problem is, put him out there at Dolphin Stadium in July and he'll have more walks than people in the stands.

I would be concerned with Lowe if I was you. Without him I don't know what the Mets would do. He's managed by Scott Boras, so a reasonable contract is out of the picture. Do you think Pedro will return? What to do about that? Someone needs to tell K Rod that the Phillies are still the team to beat.

I'd take Ollie over Lowe for the reasons above AND... if you're going to overpay, I'd rather do it for a 27 year old lefty than a 35-year old righty.

I wouldn't touch Pedro at this point. You just don't know if he's gonna give you 20+ starts or 5 starts. If they think Niese and Parnell are ready to give them starts, then MAYBE I'd take Pedro on a one year deal if Ollie and Lowe are off the table. Maine has said he'd have no problems coming out of the pen, so you could put him there and have him as insurance once Pedro hits the DL... but still... I'd want 5 other starters locked in before I'd consider bringing him back.

[Rainbow Bright]

I think Smoltz was confused, being that he actually played for The Boston Braves.

In other news, The Mariners still have a lousy, Knicks-esque lineup and Rickey Henderson is going into the hall of fame. If his plaque has him as a San Diego Surf Dawg, I'll be amused. As well as his plaque/bust has this quote on it:

"Kevin, This is Rickey. Calling on behalf of Rickey. Rickey wants to play baseball."

[TawnyVonJagger]

I think Smoltz was confused, being that he actually played for The Boston Braves.

In other news, The Mariners still have a lousy, Knicks-esque lineup and Rickey Henderson is going into the hall of fame. If his plaque has him as a San Diego Surf Dawg, I'll be amused. As well as his plaque/bust has this quote on it:

"Kevin, This is Rickey. Calling on behalf of Rickey. Rickey wants to play baseball."

Bwahahahaha!!

In other news, since this is the Yankees/Sox/Mets thread, I figured I'd throw in that the Marlins signed former Yanks pitcher Scott Proctor.

[WhiteHouseSubsAC]

And the Phillies, looking for the final piece of the multi decade dynasty, are interested in Nomar Garciaparra.

[bighairdiscs]

And the Phillies, looking for the final piece of the multi decade dynasty, are interested in Nomar Garciaparra.

Nomah usta hit homahs.... then came the Steroid testing.

[bighairdiscs]

And the Phillies, looking for the final piece of the multi decade dynasty, are interested in Nomar Garciaparra.

Nomah usta hit homahs.... then came the Steroid testing.

This guy for some reason does not get the derision that he should. For some reason, it goes to Miguel Tejada.

He was obviously a steroid guy, and gets traded and they go on to win two World Series titles while he's drinking in a dark room listening to Mia Hamm bounce soccer balls off her tits.

This is all you need to know about Nomah's steroid use:

[tin00can]

I think Smoltz was confused, being that he actually played for The Boston Braves.

In other news, The Mariners still have a lousy, Knicks-esque lineup and Rickey Henderson is going into the hall of fame. If his plaque has him as a San Diego Surf Dawg, I'll be amused. As well as his plaque/bust has this quote on it:

"Kevin, This is Rickey. Calling on behalf of Rickey. Rickey wants to play baseball."

Thing is, you can imagine that actually happening. Rickey is fucking awesome. I can't wait for his HOF speech.

[killeverything]

This guy for some reason does not get the derision that he should. For some reason, it goes to Miguel Tejada.

He was obviously a steroid guy, and gets traded and they go on to win two World Series titles while he's drinking in a dark room listening to Mia Hamm bounce soccer balls off her tits.

This is all you need to know about Nomah's steroid use:

[/quote]

Yep. I think that the reason Nomah isn't rided about roids' like Tejada is, Number one when they started testing he was off of them. Although nothing any one can say, will convince me he wasn't juicing before hand. Number 2, when Nomah broke his wrist he never recovered. He had a massive fall off before hand. The guy could have kept taked PEDs, it wouldn't have made a difference. The drop in his offensive production was enormous. It seems to be wrist injuries that kill ball players. Nomah is dead.

[JakeYonkel]

Having nothing to do with Rice being a Boston guy (I wasn't around to see him play anyway) if he gets in it's a joke.

15 years to gain admission? Like he's done something on a basefield in the past 14 to all of a sudden sway all these voters?

There should be about a 5 year eligibility period, max.

If he gets in then I would also vote for Larry Walker, Andres Galaragga, Joe Carter, Moises Alou... all guys who aren't Hall of Famers but were "scary" hitters.

The Hall has to have SOME standards. I understand that 500 home runs as a benchmark will soon be a thing of the past, but the guy didn't even crack 400. He won one MVP and made a few All Star games. Shit, he's fucking Jason Giambi at this point.

[tin00can]

Hopefully Burt Blyleven finally gets in. And I agree with Jake, having an extended eligibility period is dumb (he said, while tacitly endorsing it to get Blyleven in).

[thejuggernaut]

I am not sure I buy the "Nomar used roids" suggestion.

He certainly doesn't look like a roid user of any variety.

[WOLF]

All I know is if Rice gets in, there's no reason to not let in Andre Dawson at some point. Same thing with Henderson and Tim Raines - if Rickey was the greatest at what he did, then Raines was just a shade behind him during the 80's era.

[killeverything]

Having nothing to do with Rice being a Boston guy (I wasn't around to see him play anyway) if he gets in it's a joke.

15 years to gain admission? Like he's done something on a basefield in the past 14 to all of a sudden sway all these voters?

There should be about a 5 year eligibility period, max.

If he gets in then I would also vote for Larry Walker, Andres Galaragga, Joe Carter, Moises Alou... all guys who aren't Hall of Famers but were "scary" hitters.

The Hall has to have SOME standards. I understand that 500 home runs as a benchmark will soon be a thing of the past, but the guy didn't even crack 400. He won one MVP and made a few All Star games. Shit, he's fucking Jason Giambi at this point.

This has been discussed vebatim here, and everywhere. I personally want Rice in the Hall, but wouldn't think he was robbed if he didn't get in. His numbers are BORDERLINE. Dewey Evans had better numbers than Rice and was eliminated from the ballot, on I believe the second election. There are guys in the Hall right now with worse numbers. Now as for the 15 year eligiblility? Here's an interesting take on it, one that makes a whole lot of sense.

Full disclosure: I have not always voted for Jim Rice.
He first appeared on the Hall of Fame ballot in 1995, and I did not put an X in his box until 2000. I mention this to underscore the enormously agonizing thought process any voter goes through when evaluating a borderline Hall of Fame candidate, of which Jim Rice is almost a classic Exhibit A.

Oh, sure, it's easy when examining the case for a Mike Schmidt, George Brett, Nolan Ryan, Ozzie Smith, Wade Boggs, Cal Ripken, or Tony Gwynn, all of whom attained first-ballot enshrinement in the past 14 elections. It is similarly easy to vote yes on Rickey Henderson this year.

But there is a reason why it takes time to elect the average garden-variety Hall of Fame candidate. It's because most of us aren't sure; that's why. We're not sure, and we very much want to do the right thing, given the life consequences of a Hall of Fame designation. None of us wish to deprive a deserving candidate of the satisfaction, let alone the perks, that accompany membership in the most historic of our sports Halls of Fame. At the same time, we want to feel that the candidate really is deserving of baseball's highest individual honor.

The fact is people have never been sure. Four of the 226 people who voted in the first Hall of Fame balloting (1936) did not vote for Ty Cobb. Eleven did not vote for Babe Ruth - Babe Ruth! - and Honus Wagner. Twenty-one said no to Christy Mathewson. Thirty-seven did not think Walter Johnson passed muster. Cy Young? The man for whom pitching's biggest prize is named drew only 151 votes out of 201 cast the second year of the balloting. So from the beginning people have had individual standards as to just what a Hall of Famer should be.

Since Jim Rice's name was first placed on the ballot, the following 21 players have been elected by the Baseball Writers Association of America: Mike Schmidt, Phil Niekro, Don Sutton, Nolan Ryan, George Brett, Robin Yount, Carlton Fisk, Tony Perez, Dave Winfield, Kirby Puckett, Ozzie Smith, Eddie Murray, Gary Carter, Paul Molitor, Dennis Eckersley, Wade Boggs, Ryne Sandberg, Bruce Sutter, Cal Ripken, Tony Gwynn, and Rich Gossage.


http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/a ... orderline/

That's an interesting, and I believe fair take on the eletion fairness. I've heard so many anti-Rice sentiments. "HIs numbers were inflated by Fenway, look at his Home/Road splits." Okay that's the most arbitrary of all. Frank Robinson ( who no one argues his inclusion in the Hall ) has a H/R split of 321/265. Of course he hit better at home. Duh. "If Rice would of won in '75 or '86, he would be in." Post-Season play makes a lot to do with it. It's why Schilling has a better shot than Mussina, both are very borderline. Rice didn't play on a Championship team, like say Phil Ruzzuto ( who's in the Hall, and not very dominate ). Yet he played next to Dimaggio and has a couple of rings. ( I'm not arguing against Rizzuto, love the guy. Just an example ).

Orlando Cepeda, Tony Perez, George Kelly, Hal Newhouser, etc. Are in the Hall. How and the fuck are they in? Those guys are in, Rice isn't. The arguement of maybe he wasn't a nice guy ( to the writers )? Look at Ty Cobb, a complete racist asshole. Does anyone believe he shouldn't be in the Hall, because he was a "big meanie?"

I want Rice in.

[killeverything]

YYYYYYEEEEEEEAAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jim Rice was just elected to the Hall Of Fame!

Oh as was Rickey Henderson, but we all knew that.

[killeverything]

YYYYYYEEEEEEEAAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jim Rice was just elected to the Hall Of Fame!

Oh as was Rickey Henderson, but we all knew that.

76.4% of the votes. Finally!!

Some of the numbers are starting to come out now.

28 writers didn't vote for Rickey Henderson! I think they should have their voting priveledges revoked. Also Mo Vaughn didn't receive 5% and will be dropped from the ballot ( only 6 people voted for him ). I wish Tim Raines would get more support.

[Hootchietoad]

YYYYYYEEEEEEEAAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jim Rice was just elected to the Hall Of Fame!

Oh as was Rickey Henderson, but we all knew that.

76.4% of the votes. Finally!!

Some of the numbers are starting to come out now.

28 writers didn't vote for Rickey Henderson! I think they should have their voting priveledges revoked. Also Mo Vaughn didn't receive 5% and will be dropped from the ballot ( only 6 people voted for him ). I wish Tim Raines would get more support.

I agree, there are certain players that should be in without question. In recent memory, Henderson, Ripken, Boggs, Gwynn. Fuck though, no one has ever gotten 100%, so that will never change. The idiots that don't vote for them are holding onto some unrealistic standard, when there are dozens of members that wouldn't stand a snowballs chance in hell of getting by todays stat standards, and dominate players for their time, like Rice, suffer. The thing that most people seem top forget, that Ryan mentioned in his aryicle, is that he played pre-steriod, pre-juiced ball and still kicked ass. Some would say he was the Manny of his time...but without a consistent foil (ie Ortiz) to protect him.

[killeverything]

I love Rice more than anyone. But he was not Manny. Not even close.

In his prime, he had Fred Lynn who was great in 75 and 79. Plus the 77 team had like four guys who had 100 RBI's. He was protected fine. Plus he had Remy and Burleson table setting. Hobson, Yaz, Evans, Lynn, and whoever else I can't remember. He had protection.

Plus, Manny made Ortiz. Ortiz did not make Manny.

He also drove into more double plays than A-Rod.

No one is Manny. There will probably never be another one either. Schilling was talking about that. In regards to losing out on Teix. He was saying Teix is a great player, and would have been a great addition, but to think he could replace Manny. "No one is Manny Ramirez at the plate. That locked in, waiting for the pitch." Hate Manny all you want ( I'm really disappointed in him ), but he is one of the greatest RHH to ever play the game.

A lot of what was discussed about Rice's rally killing hitting into DPs. Is the numbers are pretty inflated, because of his RBI potential from where he batted in the line-up. Near the end of his career he was oft-injured ( hip I believe ) which is where he compiled those stats. Prior to his HOF induction. I read a discussion of "do you think Rice would have benefited
more from retiring a few years earlier?"

Oh well, it's a useless debate now. Jim Rice Hall Of Fame. I can't wait to see his commentary on NESN with "Hall Of Fame Player" next to his name.

*side note: I think RBI is a pretty over-rated stat. The number 3 or 4 hitter's historically have more RBIs. They have a better chance as opposed to the lead-off.

I can't wait for Rickey's induction speech. I bet he has like 4 arms surgically grafted on him so he can have more arms to pat himself on the back. Oh, and Itjogs, I won't take your bet. It's his induction in the HOF. I bet that they let Rice slide for being double parked.....well they might tow him.

[killeverything]

As I said before, Rice, for some reason, just fell off the table. He didn't decline gradually in order to pad up to 400 Home Runs.

His eyes went. He could no longer see the spin on the ball. They tried special lenses for him, and it seemed to help a little and then his eyand that was it.es got worse

Yep. Not unlike Kirby Puckett. I heard that comparison a couple of weeks ago. Although I wouldn't compare the two players. Jim Rice is a HOFer, but not on the level of Puckett.

A lot of this is with the research coming out because of steroids. A lot of people are looking at the numbers in a different light. It's disgusting what has been done to the game because of this shit. Oh, and Clemens' case is being discussed for a sub-peona right now. Since he lied to Congress about PEDs. Watching your chilhood hero go down like that. I even supported him when he went to NY....reluctantly, but I did.

I think that were going to see a lot fall out from the PEDs. Pertaining to HOF, and everything. There is no way they can't discuss the eras like that. Maybe not neccesarily an asterisk, but something.

Jim Rice HOF!

[Machado]

Read the ESPN scroll this morning and it was reported
the nats are interested in trading for
Nady and Swisher.

I don't know the nats roster at all, so who could the Yankees want from
that team in exchange for these 2 players?

[Punk]

There is absolutely no excuse for Rice getting in and Dave Parker not being in. Rice won 1 MVP and was an 8 time all star...Parker also won 1 MVP and was a 7 time all star. Rice won 2 Silver Slugger awards, Parker 3. Parker won 3 gold gloves, Rice zero. Parker has 2 World Series rings, Rice zero.

Dave Parker vs Rice

Games 2466 / 2089
At bats 9358 / 8225
Hits 2712 / 2452
AVG .290 / .298
2B 526 / 373
3B 75 / 79
HR 339 / 382
RBI 1493 / 1451
R 1272 / 1249
SB 154 / 58
BB 683 / 670
SLG .471 / .502
OBP .350 / .352

There is no way that a similar player who had more hits, RBIs, stolen bases, and runs, not to mention gold gloves, silver slugger awards, and World Series titles as Rice shouldn't be in there. Fuck that.

[killeverything]

Three hitters to consider after the dead ball era: Ruth/Williams/Manny.
Everyone else, to me, is on the outside.

Except that Ruth and Williams were LHH.

Unless your talking strictly talking only Red Sox hitters. In that case you forgot Jimmy Foxx.

Read the ESPN scroll this morning and it was reported
the nats are interested in trading for Nady and Swisher.

Rumors are rumors. As of 01/10, Cashman said they weren't looking to move Swisher. I for one would hang onto him. As I said before and also echoed here. That guy is a Scott Brocious.

You know who always bothered me. Paul Molitor.

That guy was like the Demi Moore of baseball. Closer they got to 40, the hotter they'd get.

Heh. Good similie.

Demi did get fucking hot as she aged. Goddamn. *swoon*

Wait. Why the fuck am I thinking about Paul Molitor now? Goddamnit! Your ruining it for me.

[Machado]

There is absolutely no excuse for Rice getting in and Dave Parker not being in. Rice won 1 MVP and was an 8 time all star...Parker also won 1 MVP and was a 7 time all star. Rice won 2 Silver Slugger awards, Parker 3. Parker won 3 gold gloves, Rice zero. Parker has 2 World Series rings, Rice zero.

Dave Parker vs Rice

Games 2466 / 2089
At bats 9358 / 8225
Hits 2712 / 2452
AVG .290 / .298
2B 526 / 373
3B 75 / 79
HR 339 / 382
RBI 1493 / 1451
R 1272 / 1249
SB 154 / 58
BB 683 / 670
SLG .471 / .502
OBP .350 / .352

There is no way that a similar player who had more hits, RBIs, stolen bases, and runs, not to mention gold gloves, silver slugger awards, and World Series titles as Rice shouldn't be in there. Fuck that.

Is it possible that voters are using Dave's history of
substance abuse against him?

Looking at the stats side by side, both players are very worthy
of entering the Hall of Fame.

[Machado]

You make very good points.

The substance abuse scandal Dave was involved with could only hurt
this chances.
Why "voters" use this against him is beyond me? The Hall has a number of people that did not behave very well off the field.

Was what Dave did that much worse? I'm not sure. That's not for me to say.
On the field, he put up the numbers, went to the all-star games, won 2 World Series and even an MVP.

[Facedown]

There is absolutely no excuse for Rice getting in and Dave Parker not being in. Rice won 1 MVP and was an 8 time all star...Parker also won 1 MVP and was a 7 time all star. Rice won 2 Silver Slugger awards, Parker 3. Parker won 3 gold gloves, Rice zero. Parker has 2 World Series rings, Rice zero.

Dave Parker vs Rice

Games 2466 / 2089
At bats 9358 / 8225
Hits 2712 / 2452
AVG .290 / .298
2B 526 / 373
3B 75 / 79
HR 339 / 382
RBI 1493 / 1451
R 1272 / 1249
SB 154 / 58
BB 683 / 670
SLG .471 / .502
OBP .350 / .352

There is no way that a similar player who had more hits, RBIs, stolen bases, and runs, not to mention gold gloves, silver slugger awards, and World Series titles as Rice shouldn't be in there. Fuck that.

I think the stats argument brings out the pros and cons of your point.
377 more games played and 1133 more at bats and he managed
260 more hits
43 less HR's
42 more RBI's
and 23 more runs.
I think he should get in too but that could play a part in another "borderline" player waiting a while.

[Punk]

It's probably the drug scandal but fuck, he had a lot of great years after that shit.

Dawson > Parker > Rice