It doesn't get any better than this...

[Cliffenstein]

But not by Jesus.

Oh I see...so your position is that we Christians should just disregard anything in the Bible that isn't expressly spoken by Jesus.

While we do so love the words of Christ, we'll probably continue sticking with the entire Bible. You know...with the Bible being the Word of God and all.

Then don't ask for a government based in Christian values, otherwise shut your piehole and render unto Caesar what is Caesar's. The thing with pseudoconservatives like you is you don't read the Bible. You let some guy in a pulpit tell you what it means. Read it yourself and you'll be shocked by how much a long haired hippie liberal the King of Kings is. I know I was.

We conservatives don't ask for government based in Christian values, we simply ask that our government continue to uphold traditional American values.

(I've personally read the Old Testament once all the way through, word for word, and the New Testament 7 times all the way through, word for word.)

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

We conservatives don't ask for government based in Christian values, we simply ask that our government continue to uphold traditional American values.

(I've personally read the Old Testament once all the way through, word for word, and the New Testament 7 times all the way through, word for word.)

Like 'Irish need not apply', 'Whites only' and 'Niggers and Chinks not allowed'? It all depends on who you ask. There are a lot of 'traditional American values' that have been dropped by the wayside for good reason. There was a time when traditional American values made your mother a 'whore' and you a 'bastard' and there are those who want to go back there even today. The good old days weren't as good as you think.

P.S.: Good luck sticking with the whole Bible. The law takes a dim view of stoning homosexuals and adulterers to death and the First Amendment requires you to suffer a witch to live but you can take comfort in that God's law trumps man's law. The upside is you'll have plenty of time to read that Bible some more. The downside is you will end up engaging in the sort of sex acts that took Sodom and Gomorrah off the map.

[Cliffenstein]

Like 'Irish need not apply', 'Whites only' and 'Niggers and Chinks not allowed'? It all depends on who you ask. There are a lot of 'traditional American values' that have been dropped by the wayside for good reason. There was a time when traditional American values made your mother a 'whore' and you a 'bastard' and there are those who want to go back there even today. The good old days weren't as good as you think.

That mindset is a joke.

And my mother and father got divorced when I was two.

I will not even quote your postscript. You know better than that if you've actually spent time in the Bible.

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

Like 'Irish need not apply', 'Whites only' and 'Niggers and Chinks not allowed'? It all depends on who you ask. There are a lot of 'traditional American values' that have been dropped by the wayside for good reason. There was a time when traditional American values made your mother a 'whore' and you a 'bastard' and there are those who want to go back there even today. The good old days weren't as good as you think.

That mindset is a joke.

And my mother and father got divorced when I was two.

I will not even quote your postscript. You know better than that if you've actually spent time in the Bible.

Traditionally divorce was bad also.
Traditions are excuses for doing stupid shit because 'that's just the way it is'.

I spent plenty of time in the Bible as part of my strict fundamentalist religious upbringing. We both realize there are parts of the Bible that are completely absurd and impractical but I'm not uncomfortable acknowledging it. For example, male homosexuality is an abomination punishable by death in God's eyes while female homosexuality hardly rates a mention. How crazy is that?

Even more Bible wackiness:

* DEUTERONOMY 22:13-21
If it is discovered that a bride is not a virgin, the Bible demands that she be executed by stoning immediately.
* DEUTERONOMY 22:22
If a married person has sex with someone else's husband or wife, the Bible commands that both adulterers be stoned to death.
* MARK 10:1-12
Divorce is strictly forbidden in both Testaments, as is remarriage of anyone who has been divorced.
* LEVITICUS 18:19
The Bible forbids a married couple from having sexual intercourse during a woman's period. If they disobey, both shall be executed.
* MARK 12:18-27
If a man dies childless, his widow is ordered by biblical law to have intercourse with each of his brothers in turn until she bears her deceased husband a male heir.
* DEUTERONOMY 25:11-12
If a man gets into a fight with another man and his wife seeks to rescue her husband by grabbing the enemy's genitals, her hand shall be cut off and no pity shall be shown her.

http://www.soulforce.org/article/homose ... -christian

[Cliffenstein]

Traditionally divorce was bad also.

It's bad now, too. My mom divorced my father after numerous adulterous affairs.

I spent plenty of time in the Bible as part of my strict fundamentalist religious upbringing. We both realize there are parts of the Bible that are completely absurd and impractical but I'm not uncomfortable acknowledging it. For example, male homosexuality is an abomination punishable by death in God's eyes while female homosexuality doesn't even rate a mention. How crazy is that?

You didn't spend enough time, man:

Romans 1: 18-32
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.

For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.

For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations and their foolish heart was darkened.

Professing to be wise, they became fools and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures.

Therefore God gave them over in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, so that their bodies would be dishonored among them. For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error.

And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper, being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful; and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

Traditionally divorce was bad also.

It's bad now, too. My mom divorced my father after numerous adulterous affairs.

I spent plenty of time in the Bible as part of my strict fundamentalist religious upbringing. We both realize there are parts of the Bible that are completely absurd and impractical but I'm not uncomfortable acknowledging it. For example, male homosexuality is an abomination punishable by death in God's eyes while female homosexuality doesn't even rate a mention. How crazy is that?

You didn't spend enough time, man:

Romans 1: 18-32
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.

For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.

For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations and their foolish heart was darkened.

Professing to be wise, they became fools and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures.

Therefore God gave them over in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, so that their bodies would be dishonored among them. For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error.

And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper, being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful; and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.

ROMANS 1:26-27
NATURAL AND UNNATURAL

What does Romans 1:26-27 say about God?

For our discussion, this is the most controversial biblical passage of them all. In Romans 1:26-27 the apostle Paul describes non-Jewish women who exchange "natural use for unnatural" and non-Jewish men who "leave the natural use of women, working shame with each other."

This verse appears to be clear: Paul sees women having sex with women and men having sex with men, and he condemns that practice. But let's go back 2,000 years and try to understand why.

Paul is writing this letter to Rome after his missionary tour of the Mediterranean. On his journey Paul had seen great temples built to honor Aphrodite, Diana, and other fertility gods and goddesses of sex and passion instead of the one true God the apostle honors. Apparently, these priests and priestesses engaged in some odd sexual behaviors -- including castrating themselves, carrying on drunken sexual orgies, and even having sex with young temple prostitutes (male and female) -- all to honor the gods of sex and pleasure.

The Bible is clear that sexuality is a gift from God. Our Creator celebrates our passion. But the Bible is also clear that when passion gets control of our lives, we're in deep trouble.

When we live for pleasure, when we forget that we are God's children and that God has great dreams for our lives, we may end up serving the false gods of sex and passion, just as they did in Paul's time. In our obsession with pleasure, we may even walk away from the God who created us -- and in the process we may cause God to abandon all the great dreams God has for our lives.

Did these priests and priestesses get into these behaviors because they were lesbian or gay? I don't think so. Did God abandon them because they were practicing homosexuals? No. Read the text again.

http://www.soulforce.org/article/homose ... -christian
Take note of this, Cliffy.

You'll also note that Romans 2 begins with "Therefore, [referring to Romans 1], you have no excuse, whoever you are, when you judge others; for in passing judgment on another you condemn yourself..." Even after he describes the disturbing practices he has seen, Paul warns us that judging others is God's business, not ours.

Who among you will cast that first stone?

Later, Cliffy.

[thejuggernaut]

I'm not bitter about anything.

Then why do your posts seem so angry and bitter?

Because he takes his money from the greatest purveyors of human destruction in the world today.

It's part of the reason he has such a dislike for big oil and anything/anyone associated with it - it's a guilt thing, so he spouts off about his hatred of one big poison while gladly collecting a paycheck from a bigger poison. Oh, but he has no misgivings about them.

LOL

[MadmanShepherd]

This is my all time favorite political advertisement...bar none. I actually get excited watching this and I don't even live in Alabama!

Here's the link:

YOUTUBE VIDEO - Dale Peterson for AG Commish

That guy is probably gay.

[Ugmo]

I'm not bitter about anything.

Then why do your posts seem so angry and bitter?

Because he takes his money from the greatest purveyors of human destruction in the world today.

It's part of the reason he has such a dislike for big oil and anything/anyone associated with it - it's a guilt thing, so he spouts off about his hatred of one big poison while gladly collecting a paycheck from a bigger poison. Oh, but he has no misgivings about them.

LOL

???

You are a total fucking loon. I wonder what it would be like to spend a day inside your brain.

[Ugmo]

I'm not bitter about anything.

Then why do your posts seem so angry and bitter?

There's no stacked deck here, dude...there's plenty of people born into poverty who grow up to be rich.

Wait, you come in here and rail against liberals and then wonder why people react to that? You're a troll just like Shaggermind, and you're getting the reaction you want. Just like when Sarah Palin sarcastically rails against liberals, so liberals think she's a cunt. (Which is not to say I think you're a cunt, just that when you come in all guns blazing in anti-liberal mode you're damn-well going to hear what we think of conservatives like the dickbag in the video you posted.)

The deck is stacked because the gap between the rich and poor has been expanding since the 1970s, and your anecdotal evidence about someone who was born poor and ended up rich doesn't measure up against the statistics.

[thejuggernaut]

Then why do your posts seem so angry and bitter?

Because he takes his money from the greatest purveyors of human destruction in the world today.

It's part of the reason he has such a dislike for big oil and anything/anyone associated with it - it's a guilt thing, so he spouts off about his hatred of one big poison while gladly collecting a paycheck from a bigger poison. Oh, but he has no misgivings about them.

LOL

???

You are a total fucking loon. I wonder what it would be like to spend a day inside your brain.

So, you DON'T dislike Big Oil and you DON'T keep yourself fed from money earned from Big Pharma ?

[thejuggernaut]

We've been going over this for MONTHS on the War Board before you showed up. Why don't you scroll through a few threads and inform yourself a little, because I have very little interest in rehashing the same points I've made a hundred times already.

Thank god you're not going to rehash your same old points, Mattie.

The deck is stacked because the gap between the rich and poor has been expanding since the 1970s, and your anecdotal evidence about someone who was born poor and ended up rich doesn't measure up against the statistics.

Well, your party ran the country into the ground for the past eight years.

As I said, we've been over this umpteen times here, but Obama's enormous deficit is largely a result of 1) very low tax revenues due to high unemployment and Bush's unfunded tax cuts and 2) high stimulus spending. If you're going to spend money, I far prefer it be spent to stimulate the economy in times of a massive recession than on tax cuts for the wealthy in prosperous economic times and ludicrously excessive military spending.

Hey, yet another Republican who either doesn't realize or doesn't want to admit that 1) much of Obama's deficit is Bush's fault and 2) the MASSIVE recession is a game changer.

Don't make me expound on my favorite topic: the redistribution of the wealth. You're aware that the wealth has been getting redistributed toward the rich ever since the 70s, right? Seems like you're okay with that though. Just another chump who votes for the Republicans while they take money out of your pocket and put it in some billionaire's pocket. And then defend their right to do so until you're blue in the face.

Here is all you need to know: the available wealth is being increasingly concentrated in the hands of the few. You are a chump because you think that's a good thing, although you presumably aren't anywhere near being one of the few.

[Cliffenstein]

ROMANS 1:26-27
NATURAL AND UNNATURAL

What does Romans 1:26-27 say about God?

For our discussion, this is the most controversial biblical passage of them all. In Romans 1:26-27 the apostle Paul describes non-Jewish women who exchange "natural use for unnatural" and non-Jewish men who "leave the natural use of women, working shame with each other."

This verse appears to be clear: Paul sees women having sex with women and men having sex with men, and he condemns that practice. But let's go back 2,000 years and try to understand why.

Paul is writing this letter to Rome after his missionary tour of the Mediterranean. On his journey Paul had seen great temples built to honor Aphrodite, Diana, and other fertility gods and goddesses of sex and passion instead of the one true God the apostle honors. Apparently, these priests and priestesses engaged in some odd sexual behaviors -- including castrating themselves, carrying on drunken sexual orgies, and even having sex with young temple prostitutes (male and female) -- all to honor the gods of sex and pleasure.

The Bible is clear that sexuality is a gift from God. Our Creator celebrates our passion. But the Bible is also clear that when passion gets control of our lives, we're in deep trouble.

When we live for pleasure, when we forget that we are God's children and that God has great dreams for our lives, we may end up serving the false gods of sex and passion, just as they did in Paul's time. In our obsession with pleasure, we may even walk away from the God who created us -- and in the process we may cause God to abandon all the great dreams God has for our lives.

Did these priests and priestesses get into these behaviors because they were lesbian or gay? I don't think so. Did God abandon them because they were practicing homosexuals? No. Read the text again.

http://www.soulforce.org/article/homose ... -christian

Take note of this, Cliffy.

You'll also note that Romans 2 begins with "Therefore, [referring to Romans 1], you have no excuse, whoever you are, when you judge others; for in passing judgment on another you condemn yourself..." Even after he describes the disturbing practices he has seen, Paul warns us that judging others is God's business, not ours.

1. I've never cared too much for reading Biblical commentary...I mean, I have read Biblical commentary, but on the whole, my thought process has always been that, hey, the Bible is translated into a language that I understand. I don't really need to read somebody telling me what the Bible says when I can read it for myself in context and see clearly what it says.

2. The VERY NEXT STATEMENT after your quote in Romans 2 says, "for you who judge practice the same things." You took the end of the sentence out, man. The passage continues with "But do you suppose this, O man, when you pass judgment on those who practice such things and do the same yourself, that you will escape the judgment of God?" This is clearly referencing hypocrisy. That doesn't mean we are to shy away from calling sin sin. As Christians, we are not to condone sin in our own lives or in the lives of other Christians or in society at large. We must also be unafraid to share the Gospel. If we are unwilling to even call sin out for what it is, how can we spread the Gospel of Salvation from sin and death through Christ Jesus?

3. Romans isn't the only place in the New Testament that speaks out against homosexuality.

1st Corinthians 6:9-11
"Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God."

[thejuggernaut]

ROMANS 1:26-27
NATURAL AND UNNATURAL

What does Romans 1:26-27 say about God?

For our discussion, this is the most controversial biblical passage of them all. In Romans 1:26-27 the apostle Paul describes non-Jewish women who exchange "natural use for unnatural" and non-Jewish men who "leave the natural use of women, working shame with each other."

This verse appears to be clear: Paul sees women having sex with women and men having sex with men, and he condemns that practice. But let's go back 2,000 years and try to understand why.

Paul is writing this letter to Rome after his missionary tour of the Mediterranean. On his journey Paul had seen great temples built to honor Aphrodite, Diana, and other fertility gods and goddesses of sex and passion instead of the one true God the apostle honors. Apparently, these priests and priestesses engaged in some odd sexual behaviors -- including castrating themselves, carrying on drunken sexual orgies, and even having sex with young temple prostitutes (male and female) -- all to honor the gods of sex and pleasure.

The Bible is clear that sexuality is a gift from God. Our Creator celebrates our passion. But the Bible is also clear that when passion gets control of our lives, we're in deep trouble.

When we live for pleasure, when we forget that we are God's children and that God has great dreams for our lives, we may end up serving the false gods of sex and passion, just as they did in Paul's time. In our obsession with pleasure, we may even walk away from the God who created us -- and in the process we may cause God to abandon all the great dreams God has for our lives.

Did these priests and priestesses get into these behaviors because they were lesbian or gay? I don't think so. Did God abandon them because they were practicing homosexuals? No. Read the text again.

http://www.soulforce.org/article/homose ... -christian

Take note of this, Cliffy.

You'll also note that Romans 2 begins with "Therefore, [referring to Romans 1], you have no excuse, whoever you are, when you judge others; for in passing judgment on another you condemn yourself..." Even after he describes the disturbing practices he has seen, Paul warns us that judging others is God's business, not ours.

1. I've never cared to much for reading Biblical commentary...I mean, I have read Biblical commentary, but on the whole, my thought process has always been that, hey, the Bible is translated into a language that I understand. I don't really need to read somebody telling me what the Bible says when I can read it for myself in context and see clearly what it says.

2. The VERY NEXT STATEMENT after your quote in Romans 2 says, "for you who judge practice the same things." You took the end of the sentence out, man. The passage continues with "But do you suppose this, O man, when you pass judgment on those who practice such things and do the same yourself, that you will escape the judgment of God?" This is clear reference to rank hypocrisy. That doesn't mean we are to shy away from calling sin sin. As Christians, we are not to condone sin in our own lives or in the lives of other Christians or in society at large. We must also be unafraid to share the Gospel. If we are unwilling to even call sin out for what it is, how can we spread the Gospel of Salvation from sin and death through Christ Jesus?

Dude, come out of it.

Jesus ?

The Bible ?

Come on !

[Cliffenstein]

Dude, come out of it.

Jesus ?

The Bible ?

Come on !

Just havin' a discussion with MasterOfMeatPuppets, that is all.

[Ugmo]

So, you DON'T dislike Big Oil and you DON'T keep yourself fed from money earned from Big Pharma ?

I don't have that much of an opinion on Big Oil. I don't think they should be receiving subsidies from the government, I do think they should be better regulated and I do think the sooner the world shakes its dependency on fossil fuels the better. Maybe you're assuming that because I'm liberal I have to hate Big Oil.

Why should I hate Big Pharma? Why should anyone? Did you know that life expectancy (in Germany at least) increased by 5 years between 1980 and 2005? Do you know why that is? The people that demonize Big Pharma are the people who broadly demonize any multinational industry. Without the pharmaceutical industry people would live a lot shorter and a lot less healthier.

But this isn't about that. This is about you remembering I said I worked for a pharmaceuical company and trying to use it as an attack on me, which just ends up making you look like the nutcase that you are.

[Cliffenstein]

Wait, you come in here and rail against liberals and then wonder why people react to that?

Seriously, that's your view? I posted a video that I thought was awesome. Go back and read the beginning of this thread and tell me who was railing against whom.

You'll see that your recollection does not match the reality of events.

[Ugmo]

Wait, you come in here and rail against liberals and then wonder why people react to that?

Seriously, that's your view? I posted a video that I thought was awesome. Go back and read the beginning of this thread and tell me who was railing against whom.

You'll see that your recollection does not match the reality of events.

Ahh... you busted me.

Whatever. Fuck Sarah Palin and fuck the jackass in that video you posted!

[thejuggernaut]

So, you DON'T dislike Big Oil and you DON'T keep yourself fed from money earned from Big Pharma ?

I don't have that much of an opinion on Big Oil. I don't think they should be receiving subsidies from the government, I do think they should be better regulated and I do think the sooner the world shakes its dependency on fossil fuels the better. Maybe you're assuming that because I'm liberal I have to hate Big Oil.

Why should I hate Big Pharma? Why should anyone? Did you know that life expectancy (in Germany at least) increased by 5 years between 1980 and 2005? Do you know why that is? The people that demonize Big Pharma are the people who broadly demonize any multinational industry. Without the pharmaceutical industry people would live a lot shorter and a lot less healthier.

But this isn't about that. This is about you remembering I said I worked for a pharmaceuical company and trying to use it as an attack on me, which just ends up making you look like the nutcase that you are.

Look at you acting like Big Pharma and Big Sugar aren't working in perfect lockstep to poison as many people as possible.

You're a very loyal servant to big poison. I tip my hat to you.

Btw, I'm not assuming anything regrading your feelings toward Big Oil. I'm just going on your own words regarding Big Oil, Schmendrick.

Again, I'm talking about the War Board. I stand by what I said. I'm conservative on many social issues, but I don't try to pass myself off as moderate because my social conservatism somehow balances out the fact that I'm anti-death penalty, anti-tax breaks for the rich, anti-Big Oil, anti-torture, anti-Guantanamo... in short, just about everything we argue about here on a daily basis.

So which is it, you're anti Big Oil or you don't have much of an opinion on Big Oil ?

[Hames Jetfield]

ROMANS 1:26-27
NATURAL AND UNNATURAL

What does Romans 1:26-27 say about God?

For our discussion, this is the most controversial biblical passage of them all. In Romans 1:26-27 the apostle Paul describes non-Jewish women who exchange "natural use for unnatural" and non-Jewish men who "leave the natural use of women, working shame with each other."

This verse appears to be clear: Paul sees women having sex with women and men having sex with men, and he condemns that practice. But let's go back 2,000 years and try to understand why.

Paul is writing this letter to Rome after his missionary tour of the Mediterranean. On his journey Paul had seen great temples built to honor Aphrodite, Diana, and other fertility gods and goddesses of sex and passion instead of the one true God the apostle honors. Apparently, these priests and priestesses engaged in some odd sexual behaviors -- including castrating themselves, carrying on drunken sexual orgies, and even having sex with young temple prostitutes (male and female) -- all to honor the gods of sex and pleasure.

The Bible is clear that sexuality is a gift from God. Our Creator celebrates our passion. But the Bible is also clear that when passion gets control of our lives, we're in deep trouble.

When we live for pleasure, when we forget that we are God's children and that God has great dreams for our lives, we may end up serving the false gods of sex and passion, just as they did in Paul's time. In our obsession with pleasure, we may even walk away from the God who created us -- and in the process we may cause God to abandon all the great dreams God has for our lives.

Did these priests and priestesses get into these behaviors because they were lesbian or gay? I don't think so. Did God abandon them because they were practicing homosexuals? No. Read the text again.

http://www.soulforce.org/article/homose ... -christian

Take note of this, Cliffy.

You'll also note that Romans 2 begins with "Therefore, [referring to Romans 1], you have no excuse, whoever you are, when you judge others; for in passing judgment on another you condemn yourself..." Even after he describes the disturbing practices he has seen, Paul warns us that judging others is God's business, not ours.

1. I've never cared to much for reading Biblical commentary...I mean, I have read Biblical commentary, but on the whole, my thought process has always been that, hey, the Bible is translated into a language that I understand. I don't really need to read somebody telling me what the Bible says when I can read it for myself in context and see clearly what it says.

2. The VERY NEXT STATEMENT after your quote in Romans 2 says, "for you who judge practice the same things." You took the end of the sentence out, man. The passage continues with "But do you suppose this, O man, when you pass judgment on those who practice such things and do the same yourself, that you will escape the judgment of God?" This is clear reference to rank hypocrisy. That doesn't mean we are to shy away from calling sin sin. As Christians, we are not to condone sin in our own lives or in the lives of other Christians or in society at large. We must also be unafraid to share the Gospel. If we are unwilling to even call sin out for what it is, how can we spread the Gospel of Salvation from sin and death through Christ Jesus?

Dude, come out of it.

Jesus ?

The Bible ?

Come on !

He's on a mission from God.

[Cliffenstein]

He's on a mission from God.

While it's quite true that I am on a mission from God (the same mission given to every saved person on Earth...that is the great commission...to spread the Gospel), if you look back through this thread you'll see that it was not me who brought up Jesus and the Bible. It was MasterOfMeatPuppets.

Not that I have any regrets with regard to him bringing it up. On the contrary, I am quite happy to engage with him on the subject.

later...Cliffy

[Ugmo]

Look at you acting like Big Pharma and Big Sugar aren't working in perfect lockstep to poison as many people as possible.

You're a very loyal servant to big poison. I tip my hat to you.

Why am I not surprised that a total nutjob like you is latching onto another conspiracy theory?

Once again, you're a loon Juggy. You probably think 9/11 was an inside job.

So which is it, you're anti Big Oil or you don't have much of an opinion on Big Oil ?

LOL at you scouring my posts. I don't remember saying that. How long ago was it, a year and a half? You'd prove your point better if you could find specific examples of me railing against big oil.

[thejuggernaut]

Look at you acting like Big Pharma and Big Sugar aren't working in perfect lockstep to poison as many people as possible.

You're a very loyal servant to big poison. I tip my hat to you.

Why am I not surprised that a total nutjob like you is latching onto another conspiracy theory?

Once again, you're a loon Juggy. You probably think 9/11 was an inside job.

Once again, you're a dunce Mattie. Either you're denying reality, or you actually believe Big Pharma's goal is anything but profit.

So which is it, you're anti Big Oil or you don't have much of an opinion on Big Oil ?

LOL at you scouring my posts. I don't remember saying that. How long ago was it, a year and a half? You'd prove your point better if you could find specific examples of me railing against big oil.

Was posting your own words too cryptic for you, the guy who just learned what a parenthetical reference is in the year 2010 ?

[Ugmo]

What year did you escape from the loonie bin Juggy? Are they out looking for you with a butterfly net?

Do you also believe the moon landing was faked and aliens are kept in Hangar 18?

[Ugmo]

Once again, you're a dunce Mattie. Either you're denying reality, or you actually believe Big Pharma's goal is anything but profit.

Every company's goal is profit dipshit.

Doesn't change the fact that you are a gullible conspiracy theorist.

[thejuggernaut]

Once again, you're a dunce Mattie. Either you're denying reality, or you actually believe Big Pharma's goal is anything but profit.

Every company's goal is profit dipshit.

Doesn't change the fact that you are a gullible conspiracy theorist.

Thanks for the newsflash, ERM.

You're a hopelessly stupid person.

To quote another poster >

"Ugmo, you're a moron. You are uninformed, ignorant, and stupid.....

You're a moron for saying moronic things. Get it? It has nothing to do with "disagreeing" with me, like we're arguing opinion. You made shit up because you're stupid and I corrected you by stating facts."

[thejuggernaut]

I don't have that much of an opinion on Big Oil. I don't think they should be receiving subsidies from the government, I do think they should be better regulated and I do think the sooner the world shakes its dependency on fossil fuels the better. Maybe you're assuming that because I'm liberal I have to hate Big Oil.

Again, I'm talking about the War Board. I stand by what I said. I'm conservative on many social issues, but I don't try to pass myself off as moderate because my social conservatism somehow balances out the fact that I'm anti-death penalty, anti-tax breaks for the rich, anti-Big Oil, anti-torture, anti-Guantanamo... in short, just about everything we argue about here on a daily basis.

Good work Mattie. Sharp like a bowl of ice cream, you are.

[Ugmo]

Every time I own you, your only retort is "You're a moron." You can tell the exact moment when you've lost a debate with me, because you start using corruptions of my real name and then pulling out the "you're a moron" insult.

Enjoy the rest of your stay at the loonie bin, nutjob!

[thejuggernaut]

Every time I own you, your only retort is "You're a moron." You can tell the exact moment when you've lost a debate with me, because you start using corruptions of my real name and then pulling out the "you're a moron" insult.

Enjoy the rest of your stay at the loonie bin, nutjob!

You have never "owned" me.

You Ugmown yourself repeatedly because you're a very dumb "man".

That's why you toss around your "cryptic" nonsense.

The precise moment YOU "lost" is when you started yammering about conspiracy theories and nutjobs.

And by the way, what "corruption" of your real name did I use ? Your real name is Matt, is it not ? Is Matty/Mattie not a variation ? I suppose in your retarded world, "Billy" is a corruption of the name "Bill".

Schmendrick.

PS Because it's amusing to watch you attempt to twist out of your own posts >

I don't have that much of an opinion on Big Oil. I don't think they should be receiving subsidies from the government, I do think they should be better regulated and I do think the sooner the world shakes its dependency on fossil fuels the better. Maybe you're assuming that because I'm liberal I have to hate Big Oil.

Again, I'm talking about the War Board. I stand by what I said. I'm conservative on many social issues, but I don't try to pass myself off as moderate because my social conservatism somehow balances out the fact that I'm anti-death penalty, anti-tax breaks for the rich, anti-Big Oil, anti-torture, anti-Guantanamo... in short, just about everything we argue about here on a daily basis.

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

Well, your party ran the country into the ground for the past eight years. Excuse me if I doubt the GOP's ability to assess anything accurately.

Considering the complaints you had about the former president's spending, how on earth do you get yourself to support this one's?

Shouldn't you be feeling a bit of "buyer's remorse" at this point?

While the religious stuff is interesting, everyone is right that it is irrelevant. To answer the question, no. I'm a liberal, you say, and Obama's a tax and spend Democrat, right? Why would I have a problem?

I voted for him because I expect him to do certain things and, as Ugmo pointed out, he has for the most part. I had no illusion that it would be cheap, easy or that it wouldn't hurt. Why you don't have buyer's remorse is a mystery no one can explain. I can't imagine it was your intention the country be left in the condition it was in on Jan 20, 2009.