An Arizona Recap...Correct me if I'm wrong

[WhiteHouseSubsAC]

Add your own thoughts, opinions, etc. I'm pretty jaded these days politically but this shit has me incensed. I cannot BELIEVE the stuff going down on our Southern Border and the complete inaction by our federal government.

Just to recap:

-The United States has an illegal immigration problem. The Federal Government has laws on the books to deal with the problem but refuses to enforce them because in 2010 it isn't politically correct to have the notion that all our residents be actual citizens of the United States.

-Arizona, realizing that the situation has escalated from people jumping the fence looking for work to violent cartels using its border as a revolving door for drug, weapon and human trafficking, passes its own law THAT MIRRORS THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENTS LAW BUT GIVES ARIZONA THE RIGHT TO ENFORCE IT. Outrage and outcry ensues, presumably by those who don't care about sovereignty and protecting our borders.

-Meanwhile, certain areas in Arizona (also WITHIN THE UNITED STATES BORDER for those not strong in Geography) are declared off limits by the Government as they have come under control of said violent cartels and are dangerous. Said violent cartels have not only informed us that they have snipers on high ground WITHIN THE UNITED STATES BORDER but they will not hesitate to shoot law enforcement agencies who attempt to disrupt their drug trafficking. Did I mention that this is all happening WITHIN THE UNITED STATES BORDER?

-Barack Obama's response to a direct invasion of our borders by foreign terrorists (and they are terrorists, terror laws have been used to prosecute Mexican gang members in California)? Not only has he ignored and virtually mocked Arizona Governor Jan Brewer's plea for help, he has instructed his administration to pursue a lawsuit in regards to the immigration package that Arizona passed (the one that MIRRORS FEDERAL LAWS).

Does anyone see anything wrong with this stance and (lack of) action? Is anyone else as pissed off and ashamed they voted for Obama as I am? McCain was no prize but I'd be willing to bet that he wouldn't stand for his state and his country to be overrun by violent criminals.

[Crazy Levi]

Holy shit dude, you fuckin nailed it!!!!

I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter and donate to your campaign.

[Nevermind]

My problem with both of you, is that you act like you're surprised.
You actually went in the voting booth thinking Barack Obama was going to be strong on border security? His positions were clear during the campaign.
Let's visit the land of wizards and bunnies, and pretend Obama was able to keep his majorities and even God forbid be reelected, the end result is amnesty for all of the illegal invaders, and the border would look just like it does right now.
Why are both of you going against your party? Why do you hate America?

[tin00can]

My problem with both of you, is that you act like you're surprised.
You actually went in the voting booth thinking Barack Obama was going to be strong on border security? His positions were clear during the campaign.
Let's visit the land of wizards and bunnies, and pretend Obama was able to keep his majorities and even God forbid be reelected, the end result is amnesty for all of the illegal invaders, and the border would look just like it does right now.
Why are both of you going against your party? Why do you hate America?

Jeez, shut the fuck up already. I think the majority of us in here were hoping he would be better than he has been, even though we didn't expect it. Nothing wrong with having hope, even while being realistic.

[WhiteHouseSubsAC]

Nevermind, I didn't vote for him due to his strength on immigration and the border but you can't tell me that you're not surprised at how far down the shitter the situation has gone with ZERO intervention from the Feds. I don't want to sound like Mattfig too much but we are getting INVADED down there and our government is doing nothing. There was nothing to indicate that Obama would give this little of a fuck or I WOULD have voted for McCain despite that retard he had on his ticket. Take your bunnies and shove them up your condescending ass.

[thejuggernaut]

Add your own thoughts, opinions, etc. I'm pretty jaded these days politically but this shit has me incensed. I cannot BELIEVE the stuff going down on our Southern Border and the complete inaction by our federal government.

Just to recap:

-The United States has an illegal immigration problem. The Federal Government has laws on the books to deal with the problem but refuses to enforce them because in 2010 it isn't politically correct to have the notion that all our residents be actual citizens of the United States.

-Arizona, realizing that the situation has escalated from people jumping the fence looking for work to violent cartels using its border as a revolving door for drug, weapon and human trafficking, passes its own law THAT MIRRORS THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENTS LAW BUT GIVES ARIZONA THE RIGHT TO ENFORCE IT. Outrage and outcry ensues, presumably by those who don't care about sovereignty and protecting our borders.

-Meanwhile, certain areas in Arizona (also WITHIN THE UNITED STATES BORDER for those not strong in Geography) are declared off limits by the Government as they have come under control of said violent cartels and are dangerous. Said violent cartels have not only informed us that they have snipers on high ground WITHIN THE UNITED STATES BORDER but they will not hesitate to shoot law enforcement agencies who attempt to disrupt their drug trafficking. Did I mention that this is all happening WITHIN THE UNITED STATES BORDER?

-Barack Obama's response to a direct invasion of our borders by foreign terrorists (and they are terrorists, terror laws have been used to prosecute Mexican gang members in California)? Not only has he ignored and virtually mocked Arizona Governor Jan Brewer's plea for help, he has instructed his administration to pursue a lawsuit in regards to the immigration package that Arizona passed (the one that MIRRORS FEDERAL LAWS).

Does anyone see anything wrong with this stance and (lack of) action? Is anyone else as pissed off and ashamed they voted for Obama as I am? McCain was no prize but I'd be willing to bet that he wouldn't stand for his state and his country to be overrun by violent criminals.

FYI McCain was a huge proponent of Amnesty.

[WhiteHouseSubsAC]

Maybe so Juggs, but to me there's a difference between Amnesty for illegals already here and letting Mexican warlord thugs rule the border (and well inside it) with their brand of lawlessness. I sincerely doubt McCain with his military background and sensibility would take this shit lying down.

[thejuggernaut]

Maybe so Juggs, but to me there's a difference between Amnesty for illegals already here and letting Mexican warlord thugs rule the border (and well inside it) with their brand of lawlessness. I sincerely doubt McCain with his military background and sensibility would take this shit lying down.

The violence problem really came to light recently because of the rancher who was killed.

If stats are to be believed, immigration is down in recent years due to the economy.

McCain was pushing for amnesty while immigration was more rampant than it is now, which included violent criminals, drug lords etc.

Just look at how the border patrol was treated during the reign of the mighty Republicans for all the answers you'd need regarding how McCain would handle it.

McCain served his country well, but he's a broken man, and has been for a long time. He gets too much nationalist credit because he has a "R" beside his name and he resides in Goldwater land. McCain is a completely liberal open borders globalist.

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

Add your own thoughts, opinions, etc. I'm pretty jaded these days politically but this shit has me incensed. I cannot BELIEVE the stuff going down on our Southern Border and the complete inaction by our federal government.

Just to recap:

-The United States has an illegal immigration problem. The Federal Government has laws on the books to deal with the problem but refuses to enforce them because in 2010 it isn't politically correct to have the notion that all our residents be actual citizens of the United States.

-Arizona, realizing that the situation has escalated from people jumping the fence looking for work to violent cartels using its border as a revolving door for drug, weapon and human trafficking, passes its own law THAT MIRRORS THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENTS LAW BUT GIVES ARIZONA THE RIGHT TO ENFORCE IT. Outrage and outcry ensues, presumably by those who don't care about sovereignty and protecting our borders.

-Meanwhile, certain areas in Arizona (also WITHIN THE UNITED STATES BORDER for those not strong in Geography) are declared off limits by the Government as they have come under control of said violent cartels and are dangerous. Said violent cartels have not only informed us that they have snipers on high ground WITHIN THE UNITED STATES BORDER but they will not hesitate to shoot law enforcement agencies who attempt to disrupt their drug trafficking. Did I mention that this is all happening WITHIN THE UNITED STATES BORDER?

-Barack Obama's response to a direct invasion of our borders by foreign terrorists (and they are terrorists, terror laws have been used to prosecute Mexican gang members in California)? Not only has he ignored and virtually mocked Arizona Governor Jan Brewer's plea for help, he has instructed his administration to pursue a lawsuit in regards to the immigration package that Arizona passed (the one that MIRRORS FEDERAL LAWS).

Does anyone see anything wrong with this stance and (lack of) action? Is anyone else as pissed off and ashamed they voted for Obama as I am? McCain was no prize but I'd be willing to bet that he wouldn't stand for his state and his country to be overrun by violent criminals.

Fuck this shit. I have a BS filter on my email to avoid this.

Last month Arizona was going to show the rest of us how to fix the immigration problem and put the 'wetbacks' in their place. They're doing a fine job.

BTW, McCain has displayed an alarming and perplexing propensity to whore himself to anyone or any thing that will benefit him. Ask Charles Keating and Vicki Iseman.

[WhiteHouseSubsAC]

Not an email, but I appreciate the opinions. I just want to get a feel for everyone's thoughts on the subject. So you don't feel that what's happening down there warrants more action than the Feds have taken so far?

[thejuggernaut]

Not an email, but I appreciate the opinions. I just want to get a feel for everyone's thoughts on the subject. So you don't feel that what's happening down there warrants more action than the Feds have taken so far?

It does, indeed.

I was simply raising the point that I wouldn't expect McCain to be better than Obama.

[WhiteHouseSubsAC]

That's fair enough, maybe he has become beholden to too many interests.

It's a tough issue for me personally because in my business I deal with/have dealt with a LOT of Mexican/Central American cooks, dishwashers, etc. and for the most part they bust their ass and are a lot of fun to work with. Sometimes I feel my anger about the stuff that goes on in the Southwest veers into Xenophobic territory, level headed debate on this helps me get perspective.

[absolutely fabulous]

peter principled.



if all our country needed was someone sitting in front of a camera singing a bill or reading a teleprompter, we'd have our man.

whenever something disastrous happens, don't we all say, thank god i'm not in that position?
well, if you run to be president, you should already anticipate to handle those situations.
seems our president and his administration is at a loss for executive actions.

[absolutely fabulous]

Not an email, but I appreciate the opinions. I just want to get a feel for everyone's thoughts on the subject. So you don't feel that what's happening down there warrants more action than the Feds have taken so far?

there were shoot ups in southern texas and
weren't cartels involved in killing the sheriff or the mayor at two different times? maybe it should be a pass, since the media didn't cover it much.

i tried to search for this, it was probably three years ago, but there's soo much going on NOW that i gave up weeding through everything.

YET, NOTHING IS BEING COVERED, here, now, then, on the networks or by the administration.

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

We have the Russian mob in NJ and NY. The Jamaicans were vicious bastards too. These are crimes occurring IN THE BORDERS OF THE STATE OF ARIZONA, after all. The Federal government does have limits on it's jurisdiction. The same Tea Party clowns who were the backbone of the immigration law are the ones preaching sovereignty and calling upon the power of the 10th Amendment.

[lerxstcat]

That's fair enough, maybe he has become beholden to too many interests.

It's a tough issue for me personally because in my business I deal with/have dealt with a LOT of Mexican/Central American cooks, dishwashers, etc. and for the most part they bust their ass and are a lot of fun to work with. Sometimes I feel my anger about the stuff that goes on in the Southwest veers into Xenophobic territory, level headed debate on this helps me get perspective.

This is really nothing new, nor is it limited to Arizona, though it's at its worst there. Someone else mentioned killings in Texas as well. One of my buds on a guitar forum lives in New Mexico and is ex-military. On a thread about guns he had described his AR-15 and an anti-gun member asked him why he needed it. He said that even though he lived 80 miles north of the U.S.-Mexico border, it was not uncommon for Mexican troops to make armed joyrides pretty far north into New Mexico. He said he wantd a fair chance to defend himself - and he is an ethnic Mexican-American, so it was not a race issue for him - simply law and order.

Those are wide open spaces and law enforcement are few and far between.

This may seem like a bit of a tangent, but it's on-point. If my friend had come upon smugglers or Mexican toops out for a joyride, they would not greet him in brotherly solidarity as a fellow Mexican. They would shoot him as a witness, which is what he knows.

It's still the Wild West out there in many ways. And while I see the comparison between the Mexican cartels and the Russian mob in NY, the difference is that the Mexicans are constantly crossing out borders, armed and in some force. They are more open and more out of control than the Russians are by a pretty strong factor.

And of course, another difference is that since Russians are mostly Caucasian, no one cries racism over any efforts to combat their criminal activities.

[SeminiferousButtNoid]

We have the Russian mob in NJ and NY. The Jamaicans were vicious bastards too. These are crimes occurring IN THE BORDERS OF THE STATE OF ARIZONA, after all.

LOL @ comparing Russians and Jamaican "organized" crime in New York with Mexican drug cartels. You really have no clue, do you?

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

We have the Russian mob in NJ and NY. The Jamaicans were vicious bastards too. These are crimes occurring IN THE BORDERS OF THE STATE OF ARIZONA, after all.

LOL @ comparing Russians and Jamaican "organized" crime in New York with Mexican drug cartels. You really have no clue, do you?

Fuck off, you pretentious pseudo-intellectual.

[Nevermind]

My problem with both of you, is that you act like you're surprised.
You actually went in the voting booth thinking Barack Obama was going to be strong on border security? His positions were clear during the campaign.
Let's visit the land of wizards and bunnies, and pretend Obama was able to keep his majorities and even God forbid be reelected, the end result is amnesty for all of the illegal invaders, and the border would look just like it does right now.
Why are both of you going against your party? Why do you hate America?

Jeez, shut the fuck up already. I think the majority of us in here were hoping he would be better than he has been, even though we didn't expect it. Nothing wrong with having hope, even while being realistic.

[Nevermind]

Nevermind, I didn't vote for him due to his strength on immigration and the border but you can't tell me that you're not surprised at how far down the shitter the situation has gone with ZERO intervention from the Feds. I don't want to sound like Mattfig too much but we are getting INVADED down there and our government is doing nothing. There was nothing to indicate that Obama would give this little of a fuck or I WOULD have voted for McCain despite that retard he had on his ticket. Take your bunnies and shove them up your condescending ass.

I can't help it you were not paying attention during the campaign. ADD?
His positions were clear. There was nothing he ever said that would indicate he would pursue a strong border defense and do his job. All he did was spout off a bunch of nonsense about comprehensive this, comprehensive that, which really only meant amnesty.
Juan Pablo McCain was no better on the issue.

[Nevermind]

Not an email, but I appreciate the opinions. I just want to get a feel for everyone's thoughts on the subject. So you don't feel that what's happening down there warrants more action than the Feds have taken so far?

Dude are you serious? Of course it does. That is why Arizona passed it's state law, to try a gain control of the situation since the Obama administration and the federal government refuse to do their constitutional duty.
Now the Obama regime is actually suing one of our own states, because they are enforcing a state law, that looks like a federal law, that the feds refuse to enforce????

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

Not an email, but I appreciate the opinions. I just want to get a feel for everyone's thoughts on the subject. So you don't feel that what's happening down there warrants more action than the Feds have taken so far?

Dude are you serious? Of course it does. That is why Arizona passed it's state law, to try a gain control of the situation since the Obama administration and the federal government refuse to do their constitutional duty.
Now the Obama regime is actually suing one of our own states, because they are enforcing a state law, that looks like a federal law, that the feds refuse to enforce????

Which situation? The law was written to drive away job stealing Mexicans, which worked. There was nothing in it that would make it more effective than current law for dealing with drug dealing Mexicans killing each other for the extremely profitable privilege of getting us high for a fee.

Those cartels are not an immigration problem. They are a direct result of the disastrous War On Drugs©.

[SeminiferousButtNoid]

We have the Russian mob in NJ and NY. The Jamaicans were vicious bastards too. These are crimes occurring IN THE BORDERS OF THE STATE OF ARIZONA, after all.

LOL @ comparing Russians and Jamaican "organized" crime in New York with Mexican drug cartels. You really have no clue, do you?

Fuck off, you pretentious pseudo-intellectual.

That is no way to talk to your superior. A simple "yes sir" will suffice.

[bane]

Obama is no better or worse than any of his predecessors dating back to Reagan on border security. This is nothing new. For the record, I believe amnesty is the right way to go. Obama, McCain and Bush all had the right idea on that issue IMO. All the knee jerk "they're here illegally, deport em now" people aren't thinking rationally, but I would agree that something has to be done to keep the cartel violence off of our side of the border. That's much easier said than done, but confusing illegal immigration with drug cartel violence is misguided. They are seperate issues.

[NeilC]

Hey Everybody,

Was McCain crappy? Yeah. But at least he had some real world experience. Obama has had exactly NONE. He has never lead anything. I just didn't realize how clueless he was on so many things. If he continues this way I think he will be HANDS DOWN the worst all time President ever( if he isn't there already).

I am just amazed at how clueless he is and his advisors are. Illegal means, "Illegal" i.e. a problem. I can't wait for when Gov. Brewer takes the White House to Court. Obama is once again going to get his ass handed to him. I do not wish it were so, he is the Commander in Chief and I don't expect anyone to always do everything 100% to my liking but this guy is #1 an academic, #2 a Liberal and #3 Arrogant. Is anyone really suprised he is doing-and will probbaly continue to do- such a crappy job? I mean, there is crappy but wow! Talk about astoundingly lousy! I didn't think it was possible! George W, on his worst day doesn't hold a candle to this guy. Who agrees with me? Who would say I am wrong?

[tin00can]

Hey Everybody,

Was McCain crappy? Yeah. But at least he had some real world experience. Obama has had exactly NONE. He has never lead anything. I just didn't realize how clueless he was on so many things. If he continues this way I think he will be HANDS DOWN the worst all time President ever( if he isn't there already).

I am just amazed at how clueless he is and his advisors are. Illegal means, "Illegal" i.e. a problem. I can't wait for when Gov. Brewer takes the White House to Court. Obama is once again going to get his ass handed to him. I do not wish it were so, he is the Commander in Chief and I don't expect anyone to always do everything 100% to my liking but this guy is #1 an academic, #2 a Liberal and #3 Arrogant. Is anyone really suprised he is doing-and will probbaly continue to do- such a crappy job? I mean, there is crappy but wow! Talk about astoundingly lousy! I didn't think it was possible! George W, on his worst day doesn't hold a candle to this guy. Who agrees with me? Who would say I am wrong?

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls ... -1044.html

About 46% of the people polled.

Maybe yourmama can pop back in and argue poll semantics with me again, even though I'm using this as a generalization.

[HollywoodBomb]

It's legal as long as you don't get caught.

[Skate4RnR]

More tacos please!

[MasterOfMeatPuppets]

More tacos please!

Where's your green card?

[HollywoodBomb]

Does anyone see anything wrong with this stance and (lack of) action? Is anyone else as pissed off and ashamed they voted for Obama as I am? McCain was no prize but I'd be willing to bet that he wouldn't stand for his state and his country to be overrun by violent criminals.

He's gonna stick it to the man and reshape America!