How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by MetalSludgeCEO »

Ale wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 10:27 am
cowpins wrote: Sun Nov 26, 2023 2:58 pm
Ale wrote: Fri Nov 24, 2023 1:06 pm Tomorrow afternoon we will have a band meeeting (I hate band meetings, 90 per cent of the times are useless) and I will say "either you get with us or there's the door".
So is he still your bass player or did the band choose him over you?
He's still the bass player for now. We had the band meeting, he said the same stupid things he always say but from now on, it's my way or he's gone. He agreed to continue playing tho he isn't in agreement, his words were "Maybe I have better musical standards that the rest of you" (a guy who never in his life booked a show or had a band with any kind of following)

Now we have two casino shows that pay VERY WELL and they're easy to do (no rehearsing a new show or anything, half originals/half covers and we're good to go) so we are doing them and then we have two months without shows (end of February we have a BIG show, the biggest we've ever done as a production and selling of the tickets and etc, so we have to work for that, let's hope with the same band)
""""""""""""""""""""Maybe I have better musical standards that the rest of you" """""""""""""""""""""""""

This guy is an arrogant cunt, and thinks he's better than all of you.

He's also, extremely delusional.

$tEvil
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Ale »

MetalSludgeCEO wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 12:14 pm
Ale wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 10:27 am
cowpins wrote: Sun Nov 26, 2023 2:58 pm

So is he still your bass player or did the band choose him over you?
He's still the bass player for now. We had the band meeting, he said the same stupid things he always say but from now on, it's my way or he's gone. He agreed to continue playing tho he isn't in agreement, his words were "Maybe I have better musical standards that the rest of you" (a guy who never in his life booked a show or had a band with any kind of following)

Now we have two casino shows that pay VERY WELL and they're easy to do (no rehearsing a new show or anything, half originals/half covers and we're good to go) so we are doing them and then we have two months without shows (end of February we have a BIG show, the biggest we've ever done as a production and selling of the tickets and etc, so we have to work for that, let's hope with the same band)
""""""""""""""""""""Maybe I have better musical standards that the rest of you" """""""""""""""""""""""""

This guy is an arrogant cunt, and thinks he's better than all of you.

He's also, extremely delusional.

$tEvil
Yes, he really thinks he is better than all of us. And tho he is a great bass player, he is not better than anybody. Delusional. But we kinda don't bother and continue. Now we have a week of two nice shows without any drama and great pay so I bet you he's not going to complain.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Cindy Buzzedimisa »

What if he decides to stick it to you right before the big show? Ego's like that do not appreciate being put in check, and revenge is best served cold. Are you sure you want to rely so heavily on him? You have time to find an understudy.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by MetalSludgeCEO »

Cindy Buzzedimisa wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 1:58 pm What if he decides to stick it to you right before the big show? Ego's like that do not appreciate being put in check, and revenge is best served cold. Are you sure you want to rely so heavily on him? You have time to find an understudy.
""""""""""What if he decides to stick it to you right before the big show? Ego's like that do not appreciate being put in check, and revenge is best served cold. """"""""""""


Funny you said this... I was going to say something similar.

Ale, or whatever your name is... heed the warning... this guy isn't happy you put him on notice... and I wouldn't be surprised if some how, some way, he tries to get back at you down the road... be it bailing on a show last minute, or making some "ultimatum" to do it this way, or else.

If he ever pulls the "or else" on you... everyone must collectively tell him, "Or else what?" and if tries to play chicken, boot him or walk on the spot.

$tEvil
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Ale »

MetalSludgeCEO wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 2:03 pm
Cindy Buzzedimisa wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 1:58 pm What if he decides to stick it to you right before the big show? Ego's like that do not appreciate being put in check, and revenge is best served cold. Are you sure you want to rely so heavily on him? You have time to find an understudy.
""""""""""What if he decides to stick it to you right before the big show? Ego's like that do not appreciate being put in check, and revenge is best served cold. """"""""""""


Funny you said this... I was going to say something similar.

Ale, or whatever your name is... heed the warning... this guy isn't happy you put him on notice... and I wouldn't be surprised if some how, some way, he tries to get back at you down the road... be it bailing on a show last minute, or making some "ultimatum" to do it this way, or else.

If he ever pulls the "or else" on you... everyone must collectively tell him, "Or else what?" and if tries to play chicken, boot him or walk on the spot.

$tEvil
You're great and I'm hearing the warning. In fact, I was browsing other stuff and I got around a video where we open for a kinda big band (a 800 people place) and we didn't get to soundcheck and in the middle of one of our songs we jammed "jumpin jack flash" and I don't even remember but I think the backing vocals were out of tune and I remembered that everytime somebody fucked up (it was not usual) he ALWAYS made funny faces and made fun of us, like he was above it.

You wanna hate the guy? it's in the first 10 seconds of this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wup0zr5Rnjs
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Michael Hotts Ghost »

Not the ideal situation, but have bass backing tracks ready to go ... (you said drummer plays with a click). The band Seven Kingdoms had their bassist flake on them and they said fuck you ... moved right along with bass backing tracks. No one gave a shit. And they are cutting his money up now by not having to pay him anymore.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by GreatWhiteSnake »

Trax are the new live. It's all good...
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Cindy Buzzedimisa »

Saw the clip. He's standing there giggling, and he's the superior one? The band guys I know would've kicked his ass for mocking them onstage like that. I cast another vote for bass backing tracks.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by cowpins »

In the video is seems that he has it in for the rhythm guitar player background vox dude.
"bus problems come on man so boring we have our bus its awesome and we r watching judge judy on it right now tour is going great 14 more shows to go see you out there rockin peeps not you garbageman you stay home" - HueyRamone, 7/3/12
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Danzig in the Dark »

Brokeband Mountain:
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by FreddyFender »

In the past month one of my bands, a covers act, made the decision to let someone go for a combination of reasons: attitude, weird behavior, lack of professionalism, making shitty comments, never having his gear right... all of it.

I'd love to post the details because it would make a hell of a thread, but long story short we had to have one of our friends bring a gun and come work as armed security to our first gig after letting him go.

After we let the guy know we were moving on, he proceeded to send upwards of a hundred of novel-length messages to the group chat and to individual members. Threatening to kill himself, begging to be let back in, attacking us, making threats, completely delusional stuff. It crossed the line from being funny and sad into dangerous territory.

I knew the first time I shook this guys hand, something was off. But before long he'd learned the whole set, and it's a pain in the ass to pull the plug and start working someone new in from scratch. It's also hard to get everyone to agree to fire someone when that guy hasn't committed some single huge infraction. So we just kept putting things off, kept ignoring things, kept letting him slide and when we did let him go it had snowballed into something crazy.

I share this because, while I doubt you'll get into such an extreme situation, we paid a price for letting issues with this guy drag on for upwards a year.

Why put yourself in that situation? At our age, everyone you work with should be a team player and thankful to get on that stage.

This guy is not that. Hire a new bass player on the lowdown and have him start learning the material.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Ale »

Ok the story has a new chapter. Almost out of the blue my bass player called me and kinda said he was sorry for his attitude and he was going to try to be a "better team player". Of course, he did said again that he believed his standards were higher cause maybe once a show one of us makes a mistake and it was unnaceptable and stuff, but unless he is playing dumb and teasing us, he would be better for now in the future.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by DonJuanDeMarco »

Ale wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 1:22 pm Ok the story has a new chapter. Almost out of the blue my bass player called me and kinda said he was sorry for his attitude and he was going to try to be a "better team player". Of course, he did said again that he believed his standards were higher cause maybe once a show one of us makes a mistake and it was unnaceptable and stuff, but unless he is playing dumb and teasing us, he would be better for now in the future.
LOL.. he probably reads the board here! Just focus on the music, man. No bands or teams or co-workers are all in love with each other. It's a business. You work together for one goal... in your case, the music and the live performance.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Cindy Buzzedimisa »

Someone saying "I'm sorry BUT! You did this and that!" isn't an apology. You're like a mistreated girlfriend who knows she should break up with her guy yet can't bring herself to do it after all the time she invested. You really should wrap your head around not having him in the band and how you're going to navigate that. Wouldn't be surprised if he's quietly looking for a "sidepiece" i.e. a band that's up to his standards and just using you in the meantime.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by MetalSludgeCEO »

Ale wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 1:22 pm Ok the story has a new chapter. Almost out of the blue my bass player called me and kinda said he was sorry for his attitude and he was going to try to be a "better team player". Of course, he did said again that he believed his standards were higher cause maybe once a show one of us makes a mistake and it was unnaceptable and stuff, but unless he is playing dumb and teasing us, he would be better for now in the future.
""""""""""""""" he believed his standards were higher """"""""""""""""

This alone is reason enough to say "F#@k off pal"

Let's switch the scenario just a tad...

What if your girlfriend or boyfriend said "I believe my standards are higher, and you're this and that..." blah, blah, blah. "But, I will stick around and try not to think that way about you anymore"

Essentially, this is what you're dealing with.

The guy thinks, acts and out-right says, he is BETTER and ABOVE you and the whole band. What an arrogant jerk.

Imagine your chick was like "Well, I am better than you... you're below me... but I will try NOT to say that anymore and we'll keep dating!"

The sane, logical and rational reasoning for anyone dealing with that is to say "Ummm, no thanks... I'll look elsewhere."

Sadly you seem to be like a beaten wife, who continues to make excuses, "He didn't punch me, it was a slap" and she (you too) puts up with it.

In the end, either way you slice it, apology or not... this guy sucks!

$tEvil
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Danzig in the Dark »

MetalSludgeCEO wrote: Sat Dec 02, 2023 10:13 am
Ale wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 1:22 pm Ok the story has a new chapter. Almost out of the blue my bass player called me and kinda said he was sorry for his attitude and he was going to try to be a "better team player". Of course, he did said again that he believed his standards were higher cause maybe once a show one of us makes a mistake and it was unnaceptable and stuff, but unless he is playing dumb and teasing us, he would be better for now in the future.
""""""""""""""" he believed his standards were higher """"""""""""""""

This alone is reason enough to say "F#@k off pal"

Let's switch the scenario just a tad...

What if your girlfriend or boyfriend said "I believe my standards are higher, and you're this and that..." blah, blah, blah. "But, I will stick around and try not to think that way about you anymore"

Essentially, this is what you're dealing with.

The guy thinks, acts and out-right says, he is BETTER and ABOVE you and the whole band. What an arrogant jerk.

Imagine your chick was like "Well, I am better than you... you're below me... but I will try NOT to say that anymore and we'll keep dating!"

The sane, logical and rational reasoning for anyone dealing with that is to say "Ummm, no thanks... I'll look elsewhere."

Sadly you seem to be like a beaten wife, who continues to make excuses, "He didn't punch me, it was a slap" and she (you too) puts up with it.

In the end, either way you slice it, apology or not... this guy sucks!

$tEvil
From what he's said, he believes this guy is superior to him and he's lucky to have him in the band.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Ozzy Stradlin »

Ale wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 1:22 pm Ok the story has a new chapter. Almost out of the blue my bass player called me and kinda said he was sorry for his attitude and he was going to try to be a "better team player". Of course, he did said again that he believed his standards were higher cause maybe once a show one of us makes a mistake and it was unnaceptable and stuff, but unless he is playing dumb and teasing us, he would be better for now in the future.
I give you two months (tops) and he’s going to be back with his usual bullshit or worse, and you’re going to kick yourself for still being in this predicament and not getting rid of him sooner.

If you’re not going to give him the boot now, at LEAST keep your ear to the ground and your eyes open for potential replacements. And if you find someone that you think will fit the bill, and you trust them (which is essential, if you ask me) - try to gauge his/her interest & begin a dialogue - up to and including everything you told us. You might even consider a little “side project” jam including everyone in your band except your current bass player to see how it feels, etc.

You might need someone good in a pinch, and you’ll want the transition to be as seamless as possible.

Good luck, and keep us posted.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by DavidLeeLarsUlrichRoth »

eddie lee roth wrote: Wed Nov 22, 2023 11:28 am How big a boy is your bass player?

I’ll come down there and whoop his ass.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by the_man_incognito »

What is it with bass players?
We had a bass player that the drummer and I think is bi-polar...you didn't know if he was going to show up and be a dick or cool...
Sometimes he's just flake and not talk to us for a couple months if we didn't have shows...and as shows (and even a couple video shoots) approached, didn't really know if he was going to show up and I worked to have a contingency plan set up...then last minute, he's say he'd be there....
The last year he was in, just go worse and was always a black cloud...but we hated to loose him because he was a damn good player one of the best best players in our scene...
And he was one of those guys who wanted to be a 'leader' and make decisions, but, he never did anything to book shows, make contacts or anything else related to running the business of the band...but loved playing shows and wanting to be part of the creative process...
He was in the band almost 5 years...should have let him go 2 years ago...we just let him go a few months ago and while we still don't have a permanent replacement, it's a relief he's not around....
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Wednesday 13 Fan »

I wouldn't be surprised if he held you up for money when those big shows come, and quits right after now that he knows how you feel. I'd definitely vote "Fire Him" too.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Turner Coates »

FreddyFender wrote: Thu Nov 30, 2023 4:57 pm
I'd love to post the details because it would make a hell of a thread, but long story short we had to have one of our friends bring a gun and come work as armed security to our first gig after letting him go.
Is it a country group or is it a hip hop group?
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by DemonFilth2001 »

Turner Coates wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2023 9:29 am
FreddyFender wrote: Thu Nov 30, 2023 4:57 pm
I'd love to post the details because it would make a hell of a thread, but long story short we had to have one of our friends bring a gun and come work as armed security to our first gig after letting him go.
Is it a country group or is it a hip hop group?
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Ale »

I'ts been fun reading the answers and the advices and the other problems with other bands.

Wow at having to have an armed man to take care of you. My bass player is harmless, he's just have a delusional way of thinking about music. This weekend we have the two " easy" shows and he is nice enough this week so there's hope. At the end of the day, I call the shots. So if there's another just tiny burst of being difficult, he's out. We have two months "off" (we're recording some things) of shows next week on, so let's see how it alls unfolds.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Cindy Buzzedimisa »

Oh wow, he can find it in himself to be nice for a minute! You can totally let your guard down now! No. And stop making excuses for this guy. He should have outgrown being immature and delusional a long time ago. You sure have a high tolerance for being embarrassed. Its obvious you're going to ignore us and stick with this guy and you're going to regret it big time.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by Ale »

Cindy Buzzedimisa wrote: Wed Dec 06, 2023 2:33 pm Oh wow, he can find it in himself to be nice for a minute! You can totally let your guard down now! No. And stop making excuses for this guy. He should have outgrown being immature and delusional a long time ago. You sure have a high tolerance for being embarrassed. Its obvious you're going to ignore us and stick with this guy and you're going to regret it big time.
No, it's not obvious. I believe in chances in life. He is a pain in the ass, yes, but if he can play nice, he stays. As soon as the first thing that I don't like, he's out. I'll keep you informed.
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Re: How long and much do you keep an unbearable good musician?

Post by john3232 »

I agree with those who feel you should replace him. You're 40 and in a band. You should be having fun. If you're not either quit or get a new bass player.
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