Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Moderator: Metal Sludge
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
"one of the best albums of all time..."
Holy fucking christ.
This is like a thread of the head injured.
Holy fucking christ.
This is like a thread of the head injured.
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
I’d stop short of brilliant, myself, but definitely very good, and light years better than Bark at the Moon.
-
- Jamming in Parent's Basement
- Posts: 88
- Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2023 1:42 pm
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Damn, so cool to hear all the intricacies that are missing from the album mix. I’ve always loved both the Jake era CD’s and I know this will be considered blasphemy but I like his playing better than Randy.sicktwistedfreak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 2:49 amThis one?HottKarl777 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 19, 2024 9:10 pm Fuck yeah it is. Jake's rhythm playing is unbelievably creative. Unfortunately its hard to hear everything he's doing with the mix. I went on You Tube and found some dude playing "Never" and when you see and hear all the little things Jake is doing it is fucking mind boggling how cool it is.
There weren't too many shredders that threw down on busy rhythm parts that hard and went past power chords into EVH inspired chord inversions. Jake studied piano like Ed so his brain is way more musical than your average dipshit blues box guitar player.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hS7x2R6aqAs
- Love_Industry
- Signed to a Major Label Multi-Album Deal
- Posts: 17586
- Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 1:49 pm
- Location: Zasransk, Belarus
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Yeah, they didn't even try there. So much filler and more obvious than on both Bark and No Rest. Add to that crap lyrics on half the album, I mean "You never know why we rock, we rock"... "Rockin all night until the Lightning Strikes again" ... $haron PAID someone to write that?BernieTaupson wrote: ↑Fri Apr 19, 2024 4:10 pm Some good songs and great playing let down by the mix sounding like shit, and not enough variety in the tunes.
A bunch of them are pretty much just the same song. Never, Never Know Why, Lightning Strikes, Fool Like You … how many mid tempo rockers did they need?
But Killer of Giants, Secret Loser and SitD are great.
- Chip Z'Hoy
- Playing First Stage at SludgeFest
- Posts: 29900
- Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:29 pm
- Location: Between here and there
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
I celebrate both the Randy and Jake albums as "classic Ozzy."
Ozzy's success with Zakk speaks for itself, and NMT is a great album, but it was a different vibe. Ozzy was trying to become more respectable and choke out his wife less. The music suffered.
Ozzy's success with Zakk speaks for itself, and NMT is a great album, but it was a different vibe. Ozzy was trying to become more respectable and choke out his wife less. The music suffered.
LAglamrocker wrote: ↑Sun Feb 18, 2024 3:56 pmClub was packed with Metal Edge fans 18-30..no stupid Rush Roll The Bones dipsh*ts
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.
-
- Debut Album Goes Gold
- Posts: 3982
- Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 8:31 pm
- Location: Vancouver
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Blizzard is not over-rated, and it has nothing to do with your age range. It's always the songwriting, and the songs on Blizzard are better than those on the albums Jake played on, or anything past that.WCiezak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:39 pm There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.
- Indy_Rob
- Headlining a Theater Tour
- Posts: 6670
- Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 4:52 am
- Location: Indianapolis, IN
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Not blasphemy. Totally agreed. I always liked Jake better than Randy.DrumminAway wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 11:41 am I know this will be considered blasphemy but I like his playing better than Randy.
- Ziggy Sawdust
- Doing Package Tours in Theaters
- Posts: 5424
- Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 3:00 am
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
You just need to get past the production and the songs will eventually click.
Hell'sHungryChild wrote:
I have no desire to pay $150 to see an ant sized Ac/Dc and drink $12 beer cups.
- HottKarl777
- Playing Decent Clubs in a Bus
- Posts: 1877
- Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 3:38 pm
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
sicktwistedfreak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 2:49 amThis one?HottKarl777 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 19, 2024 9:10 pm Fuck yeah it is. Jake's rhythm playing is unbelievably creative. Unfortunately its hard to hear everything he's doing with the mix. I went on You Tube and found some dude playing "Never" and when you see and hear all the little things Jake is doing it is fucking mind boggling how cool it is.
There weren't too many shredders that threw down on busy rhythm parts that hard and went past power chords into EVH inspired chord inversions. Jake studied piano like Ed so his brain is way more musical than your average dipshit blues box guitar player.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hS7x2R6aqAs
Yep thats the one. He even has a powder blue guitar that looks like the Charvel Jake used at the US Festival. This guy on the video is REALLY fucking good at playing Jakes stuff. I wish he would do the whole album. There is another kid on You Tube that did all the solos for Blizzard, Diary, Bark, and Ultimate and he just nails them. He made me realize just how great Jake was when you see the licks being played that fast and how melodic his lines are.
- sicktwistedfreak
- Opening for Slaughter
- Posts: 487
- Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:20 am
- Location: Houston, TX
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Whether it's his outer glaze or cream-filled insides, King Ding Dong gets his subjects filthy!
- Ziggy Sawdust
- Doing Package Tours in Theaters
- Posts: 5424
- Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 3:00 am
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Dyslexicheart wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 4:30 pmBlizzard is not over-rated, and it has nothing to do with your age range. It's always the songwriting, and the songs on Blizzard are better than those on the albums Jake played on, or anything past that.WCiezak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:39 pm There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.
Blizzard is overated. Goodbye To Romance is terrible, worse than Dreamer. No Bone Movies is terrible. Diary is great front to back.
Hell'sHungryChild wrote:
I have no desire to pay $150 to see an ant sized Ac/Dc and drink $12 beer cups.
- pieceofme
- Signed to a Major Label Multi-Album Deal
- Posts: 21522
- Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 12:49 pm
- Location: Downtown Vancouver
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Blizzard is indeed one of the most overrated metal albums of all time.Ziggy Sawdust wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 5:14 amDyslexicheart wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 4:30 pmBlizzard is not over-rated, and it has nothing to do with your age range. It's always the songwriting, and the songs on Blizzard are better than those on the albums Jake played on, or anything past that.WCiezak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:39 pm There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.
Blizzard is overated. Goodbye To Romance is terrible, worse than Dreamer. No Bone Movies is terrible. Diary is great front to back.
Never understood the hype for it.
The only good part of crazy train is the intro.
GrayAntiMatter wrote:EVH
Zappa is pure cult status shit. He is to music what Bruce fucking Campbell is to acting....
- Chip Z'Hoy
- Playing First Stage at SludgeFest
- Posts: 29900
- Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:29 pm
- Location: Between here and there
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
This is OUTRAGEOUS nonsense.
LAglamrocker wrote: ↑Sun Feb 18, 2024 3:56 pmClub was packed with Metal Edge fans 18-30..no stupid Rush Roll The Bones dipsh*ts
- Psychobolia.com
- Playing a Package Tour in Arenas
- Posts: 12862
- Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 4:17 am
- Location: Paris, France, land of sleaze and cheese, wine and whine
- Contact:
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Agreed.
But another vote for Goodbye to Romance sucking. I'll take any of his other ballads over this turd, including So Tired and Dreamer.
-
- Debut Album Goes Gold
- Posts: 3982
- Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 8:31 pm
- Location: Vancouver
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
I agree that Diary is great front to back, better than Blizzard. But Blizzard is not overrated in my opinion. it was different than anything that came out before, a modern-day Sabbath.Ziggy Sawdust wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 5:14 amDyslexicheart wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 4:30 pmBlizzard is not over-rated, and it has nothing to do with your age range. It's always the songwriting, and the songs on Blizzard are better than those on the albums Jake played on, or anything past that.WCiezak wrote: ↑Sat Apr 20, 2024 3:39 pm There is a lot of great stuff on this album. Blizzard is overrated by Trunkers, guys who are around the same age as Eddie Trunk who are also obsessed with stuff released from around 1976-1982 when most of em were in middle and high school. Blizzard and Diary have the stronger singles, but they are very inconsistent albums. Bark is more consistent but doesn't have standout songs beyond the title track. Just one decent song after another. Ultimate has the consistency of Bark but not the creativity but is also boasting classics like Secret Loser and Shot In The Dark. Killer of Giant is also quite good. The title track is above average. The rest of it is not bad, it's just decent. No Rest For The Wicked is a step back. No More Tears was the most commercial and had the biggest hooks of anything. And that ends the classic Ozzy era. Today it is extremely rare to get an album with songs that can touch most of what's on Ultimate Sin. The Ozzy Shot In The Dark is far better than the version written by the FM guys.
Blizzard is overated. Goodbye To Romance is terrible, worse than Dreamer. No Bone Movies is terrible. Diary is great front to back.
-
- Platinum Artist
- Posts: 10658
- Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 7:56 am
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
"Diary" > "Blizzard" - the mix on "Blizzard" has always seemed a bit "thin" to me, whereas "Diary" has a lot of bottom end and heft.
I feel the same way about "The Ultimate Sin" - thin. but the album as a whole is great. producer Ron Nevison was in high demand for a few years, he produced quite a few albums then - Heart, KISS, Europe, Vince Neil.
I remember that time in my life pretty vividly thanks to this album. "Shot In The Dark" was all over MTV, the genre was going strong. life was simpler back then.
good times.
I feel the same way about "The Ultimate Sin" - thin. but the album as a whole is great. producer Ron Nevison was in high demand for a few years, he produced quite a few albums then - Heart, KISS, Europe, Vince Neil.
I remember that time in my life pretty vividly thanks to this album. "Shot In The Dark" was all over MTV, the genre was going strong. life was simpler back then.
good times.
- Chip Z'Hoy
- Playing First Stage at SludgeFest
- Posts: 29900
- Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:29 pm
- Location: Between here and there
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
"Shot in the Dark" was the first I'd ever heard or seen Ozzy. So I thought that's just what Ozzy looked like--a crying old lady.
LAglamrocker wrote: ↑Sun Feb 18, 2024 3:56 pmClub was packed with Metal Edge fans 18-30..no stupid Rush Roll The Bones dipsh*ts
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
For me, Blizzard and Diary are about 4 or 5 songs:
I Don't Know
Crazy Train
Goodbye To Romance
Suicide Solution
Mr. Crowley
Diary:
Over The Mountain
Flying High Again
You Can't Kill Rock N Roll
SATO
Diary of A Madman
Crazy Train is stronger than anything on Diary, but you remove it and Diary is a far stronger selection of songs. I'll take Secret Loser and Shot in the Dark over anything from Blizzard and Diary. Bark sounds like the songs are being played a bit too slow. It sounds like a very casual album. Ultimate Sin is pretty easy for me to listen to from beginning to end. I just enjoy it more than the others. And yes, Trunkers do overrate everything that was released when they were in high school. They're the type of fan who thinks Defenders of the Faith is a big letdown.
I Don't Know
Crazy Train
Goodbye To Romance
Suicide Solution
Mr. Crowley
Diary:
Over The Mountain
Flying High Again
You Can't Kill Rock N Roll
SATO
Diary of A Madman
Crazy Train is stronger than anything on Diary, but you remove it and Diary is a far stronger selection of songs. I'll take Secret Loser and Shot in the Dark over anything from Blizzard and Diary. Bark sounds like the songs are being played a bit too slow. It sounds like a very casual album. Ultimate Sin is pretty easy for me to listen to from beginning to end. I just enjoy it more than the others. And yes, Trunkers do overrate everything that was released when they were in high school. They're the type of fan who thinks Defenders of the Faith is a big letdown.
-
- Headlining Clubs
- Posts: 2241
- Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:06 pm
- Location: West Hollywood, California
- Contact:
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
I remember dating a girl in the early 2000's who used to work for Sharon and she told me the first task she was assigned was to scrub all the pics of Ozzy with Jake like that era never existed. To me Jake saved Ozzy at that time as he was the perfect replacement for him, what a way to thank him, such a cunt.
The Inappropriate Earl Podcast is on Itunes or Soundcloud
https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/ina ... 96362?mt=2
https://soundcloud.com/inappropriate-earl
http://www.twitter.com/earlskakel
New comedy album out on Itunes under Earl Skakel
https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/ina ... 96362?mt=2
https://soundcloud.com/inappropriate-earl
http://www.twitter.com/earlskakel
New comedy album out on Itunes under Earl Skakel
- Bono Nettencourt
- MSX Tour Support Act
- Posts: 4411
- Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2022 12:32 pm
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
ijwthstd wrote: obviously you take this way too seriously and were deeply affected by what transpired in the early 1990's and hopefully you are discussing these issues with a therapist in addition to other fans on music message boards.
-
- Opening for Slaughter
- Posts: 488
- Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2004 5:29 am
- Location: Atlanta, GA
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Nobody wrote shit like Jake back then. This guy does a great lesson on the Lightning Strikes solo, and I never realized how awesome it was until I saw this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nY2Ct-erU6I&t=10s
- HottKarl777
- Playing Decent Clubs in a Bus
- Posts: 1877
- Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 3:38 pm
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Thrasherfan17 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 6:03 pm Nobody wrote shit like Jake back then. This guy does a great lesson on the Lightning Strikes solo, and I never realized how awesome it was until I saw this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nY2Ct-erU6I&t=10s
Yeah man that is exactly what I'm talking about. Jake would put major key chords in these heavy songs to solo over and he did it beautifully like EVH and Vito Bratta. These guys were composing from their hearts and brains and not just regurgitating pentatonic licks real fast.
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Jake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
shit, she even held a grudge against Carmine Appice for little to no reason:aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pmJake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCNz7Myklrs
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
That situation was even nastier because Carmine was already a big name when he joined Ozzy.veritas wrote: ↑Mon Apr 22, 2024 5:36 amshit, she even held a grudge against Carmine Appice for little to no reason:aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pmJake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCNz7Myklrs
Sharon's mindset from day 1 is that Ozzy is the only reason there's any albums and tickets being sold. Everyone else is replaceable, so simply giving someone the opportunity to be in Ozzy's band is already more than they're worth. Therefore, anyone who isn't happy with whatever they give them beyond that is an ungrateful troublemaker.
And of course, she has a point to some degree but the level to which she's disrespected/fucked over/been a shady royal cunt is next level indefensible.
And yes, Wendy Dio was the same way. And in both cases neither Ozzy nor Dio had the balls to stand up to them.
So when Carmine joined, him simply being a "name" already made him a "threat' in her eyes. Making money on the side with drum clinics? You're an asshole!
- Bono Nettencourt
- MSX Tour Support Act
- Posts: 4411
- Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2022 12:32 pm
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Never understood her holding a grudge since he was fired. Does Hakk have any songwriters credit?aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pmJake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
ijwthstd wrote: obviously you take this way too seriously and were deeply affected by what transpired in the early 1990's and hopefully you are discussing these issues with a therapist in addition to other fans on music message boards.
- Indy_Rob
- Headlining a Theater Tour
- Posts: 6670
- Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 4:52 am
- Location: Indianapolis, IN
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Mon Apr 22, 2024 1:23 pmNever understood her holding a grudge since he was fired. Does Hakk have any songwriters credit?aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pmJake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
In her mind, she's just pissed that Jake put his foot down and refused to do Ultimate Sin without credits ahead of time (which is how they fucked him on Bark At The Moon). She's the kind of cunt who would never let that go, because it wasn't on "her terms".Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Mon Apr 22, 2024 1:23 pmNever understood her holding a grudge since he was fired. Does Hakk have any songwriters credit?aznsquirt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 9:52 pmJake put his foot down and actually forced them to give him the writing credits he deserved on Ultimate Sin, and Sharon is such a raging cunt she never let it go.Bono Nettencourt wrote: ↑Sun Apr 21, 2024 3:11 pm What happened there? They fired him, right? So why the lingering animosity?
Zakk has had extensive credits on all of the albums since he joined the band. I've never heard any whispers of any beef with him and Ozzy or Sharon, or if he had to fight for credits in any way.
It's possible that her attitude had shifted by the Zakk era. Without knowing much else, my very gut instinct is that by that time Sharon saw enough zeros in the bank account that she could turn the "cutthroat cunt" dial down a bit. But just a bit.
- Bono Nettencourt
- MSX Tour Support Act
- Posts: 4411
- Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2022 12:32 pm
Re: Ultimate Sin is a brilliant album
He was also a 20-yo kid from Jersey who was just happy to be there, so I'm sure he was more amenable to keeping quiet and doing whatever he was told.
ijwthstd wrote: obviously you take this way too seriously and were deeply affected by what transpired in the early 1990's and hopefully you are discussing these issues with a therapist in addition to other fans on music message boards.