Killeverything's (New)NeverEndingBaseballThread

[killeverything]

Jesus fucking Christ Pappelbon is going to give me a fucking heart attack. A one run victory against a 2-17 team? Chest high fastballs at the letters? No location on the slider. He threw a couple filthy splits, but it's like a pitch to contact closer now.

By the time he hits FA, he'll be back as middle relief making league minimum. His elite days are over. Unless of course they can find the same doctors that made Rivera into a half man/half machine hybrid.

[SkyDog112046]

Jesus fucking Christ Pappelbon is going to give me a fucking heart attack. A one run victory against a 2-17 team? Chest high fastballs at the letters? No location on the slider. He threw a couple filthy splits, but it's like a pitch to contact closer now.

By the time he hits FA, he'll be back as middle relief making league minimum. His elite days are over. Unless of course they can find the same doctors that made Rivera into a half man/half machine hybrid.

Time for some Tommy John surgery. A year and a half from now and he'll be lights-out again.

[killeverything]

We don't technically know if it's an injury. It seems like it. I have no faith in the medical staff anymore, especially after the way it all went down with Lowell. It leaves a lot to be desired.

And fuck TJ surgery. I want the Top Secret program that Rivera went through. I've seen the show ( on re-runs ) "we have the technology. We can rebuild him" *cue wah ah ah" sound effect*

[SkyDog112046]

We don't technically know if it's an injury. It seems like it. I have no faith in the medical staff anymore, especially after the way it all went down with Lowell. It leaves a lot to be desired.

And fuck TJ surgery. I want the Top Secret program that Rivera went through. I've seen the show ( on re-runs ) "we have the technology. We can rebuild him" *cue wah ah ah" sound effect*

Cue the commercial effects:
Are your pitchers not as effective in the post-steroid era? Let us tighten up their UCL and add 5-7 MPH to their fastball. Tommy John surgery, it isn't just for injuries anymore.

[tin00can]

Kendry Morales is looking pretty damn good so far. Now if Scioscia would just move Matsui to #3, Morales to #4, and Hunter to #5, the lineup would be sweet!

[killeverything]

Kendry Morales is looking pretty damn good so far. Now if Scioscia would just move Matsui to #3, Morales to #4, and Hunter to #5, the lineup would be sweet!

They're still winning though.

The problem is with line-up construction is it doesn't have as much of an impact on the game as people think. Batting order isn't really THAT important. For example in the context of setting up RBI oppurtunitites, The hitter has more oppurtunities by plate appearances. Like a leadoff and number nine hitter, have more plate appearances throughout the game, hence more oppurtunities.

Aside from the obvious like batting a Manny/Oritz, Arod/Teix, etc. back to back. You bat your lower OBP player third since that player is the least likely to lead off a second inning ( Bill James 1988 Baseball Abstract. Also researched further by Baseball Prospectus in 2005 ). In scoring the least amount of runs are scored in the second inning. Most in the first, and then the same amount the next seven.

By that logic Matsui's .380 shouldn't be third. Maybe Abreu's .280/.316/.446 could work in that postition. He has a .762OPS so in front of Matsui with a .943OPS is a pretty good combo. Abreu has a .176ISO which is still some good pop at the plate.

[tin00can]

Lineup order has always been interesting to me, especially in regards to how Scioscia does it - for instance, sticking with Vlad in the clean-up spot last year even when he was horrible. As you pointed out, the most important stat is wins, but it still makes for a good debate.

[killeverything]

Lineup order has always been interesting to me, especially in regards to how Scioscia does it - for instance, sticking with Vlad in the clean-up spot last year even when he was horrible. As you pointed out, the most important stat is wins, but it still makes for a good debate.

When I was cruising through Anaheim's BAA they're pretty set 1-7. Especially with the game Scoscia plays. I think it's a nice problem to have. Abreu's ISO has steadily declined with age, but with a projection of .157 and a .280/.314 in front of Matsui? Then there's still Hunter to deal with.

[JakeYonkel]

In that Baseball Prospectus By the Numbers book, they tackled this exact topic.

Billy Martin pulled the Yankee lineup out of a hat in 1977 one day. I can't find the lineup online but it was wonky, as you could imagine.

BTW, the book said that ultimately lineup order didn't matter much.

[killeverything]

In that Baseball Prospectus By the Numbers book, they tackled this exact topic.

Billy Martin pulled the Yankee lineup out of a hat in 1977 one day. I can't find the lineup online but it was wonky, as you could imagine.

BTW, the book said that ultimately lineup order didn't matter much.

Yep.

I'm glad you finally got the book. Interesting as hell ain't it? I actually pulled mine out to respond to Tin's original post.

[SkyDog112046]

This Red Sox team is really bad. I thought going into the season that they would finish in 3rd with around 90 wins and just a few games behind Tampa and NY. But now I'm thinking 78-80 wins and 4th place. Theo really screwed them up over the winter. The only positive thing is that a lousy season should get rid of some of the pink hats.

[JakeYonkel]

In that Baseball Prospectus By the Numbers book, they tackled this exact topic.

Billy Martin pulled the Yankee lineup out of a hat in 1977 one day. I can't find the lineup online but it was wonky, as you could imagine.

BTW, the book said that ultimately lineup order didn't matter much.

Yep.

I'm glad you finally got the book. Interesting as hell ain't it? I actually pulled mine out to respond to Tin's original post.

Finally?? I got that like 4 years ago when you first recommended it! I flew through it in about 2 weeeks and it's been in a box in my parents' basement 1000 miles away ever since, but still!

[killeverything]

In that Baseball Prospectus By the Numbers book, they tackled this exact topic.

Billy Martin pulled the Yankee lineup out of a hat in 1977 one day. I can't find the lineup online but it was wonky, as you could imagine.

BTW, the book said that ultimately lineup order didn't matter much.

Yep.

I'm glad you finally got the book. Interesting as hell ain't it? I actually pulled mine out to respond to Tin's original post.

Finally?? I got that like 4 years ago when you first recommended it! I flew through it in about 2 weeeks and it's been in a box in my parents' basement 1000 miles away ever since, but still!

That's right. It wasn't BBBTN I was always asking "did you get it yet" about. It was "Summer Of '49".

[JakeYonkel]

Phillies extended Ryan Howard for 5 years and $125M.

Yikes.

[Machado]

Man, that was a vicious hit Teixeira put on Wilson. It's tough for me to be fair about it, but I think he went in with his shoulder too high. It sure would be nice to see some sort of retaliation against him, but with a Scioscia team that will never happen.

Of course it sucks when a player is injured, but that was a clean play.
Yes it was vicious because of the way he catcher hit his head & his ankle was caught underneath. Add to that Tex is a very large person who had plenty of momentum going for him.

It's taken a few days, but Angels catcher Bobby Wilson finally has some idea of what happened to him Friday night in a violent collision at the plate with Yankees first baseman Mark Teixeira.

"I just don't remember anything that went on,'' Wilson said. "My head was pounding. When I was at the plate I was out of it, I don't remember anybody talking to me. I was out."

Now that he's seen replays -- too many replays, actually -- he has a better idea of how he went from starting his first game in the majors to the emergency room at Chapman University hospital and then to the 15-day disabled list with a concussion and sprained left ankle.

"It was a pretty good collision, huh?" he joked before Sunday's series-finale with the Yankees. "My dad was telling me, 'Can you call ESPN and tell them to stop showing it. I'm getting sick watching it.'"

Some of his teammates have questioned the play and Teixeira's motives for barrelling into him since Wilson was behind the plate and up the first base line, but Wilson said he harbors no ill-will for Teixeira.

"He was playing baseball," Wilson said. "He was playing hard. I know he got hit a few pitches earlier, but he was playing baseball.

"Now I wish he would've [slid], but there's no hard feeling toward Tex. I know the kind of person he is. I know his intent wasn't to hurt me. People can say what they want, if they think it's clean, or they think it's dirty, it's baseball. Next time it comes around I'm not going to back down. I'm not going to shy away from contact just cause this happened. It's part of the game."

It's part of the game, but it is still pretty disappointing for the 27-year-old rookie who was looking at his first extended opportunity to play in the major leagues with Jeff Mathis out six to eight weeks with a fractured right wrist.

[SkyDog112046]

Phillies extended Ryan Howard for 5 years and $125M.

Yikes.

How many years before they regret that one? I say three.

[Machado]

[Machado]

Schilling, a former major league pitcher and current analyst for ESPN and contributor to ESPNBoston.com, appeared on ESPN Radio's "The Herd with Colin Cowherd" on Monday, and said he doesn't expect Vazquez to be successful in New York.


"I never ever thought the move to New York the first time was a good one [for Vazquez]. And I didn't think this [move] was good as well," Schilling said. "I don't think he suddenly learned how to pitch when he went back to Atlanta and dealt last year. He's a phenomenal National League pitcher. It's hard to say this without sounding disrespectful and I don't mean it that way -- the National League is an easier league to pitch in, period. And some guys aren't equipped to get those same outs in the American League, and he's one of those guys."



Schilling also indicated he doesn't think Vazquez is comfortable with the media glare that comes with playing in New York.

"[Vazquez] thrived in Montreal and he thrived in Atlanta, and those are both second-tier cities from a baseball passion perspective. He's not a guy that I've ever felt was comfortable in the glow," Schilling said. "You're seeing what you're gonna get from him consistently all year. Having said that, he could turn around next week and throw a one-hitter with his stuff. I just don't see him being a consistent winner in the American League."

[JakeYonkel]

I agree.

I figured he'd serviceable as the #4 guy, and certainly better than this. But he's just been BRUTAL.

He'll turn it around to an extent, but I really thought he'd win 12-14 games and post an ERA around 4 or so.. acceptable and desirable, really.

I don't think there's anybody with a brain that'll admit that pitching in both leagues is the same. He's an NL pitcher.

Look at fucking Carlos Silva!

[killeverything]

I agree.

I figured he'd serviceable as the #4 guy, and certainly better than this. But he's just been BRUTAL.

He'll turn it around to an extent, but I really thought he'd win 12-14 games and post an ERA around 4 or so.. acceptable and desirable, really.

I don't think there's anybody with a brain that'll admit that pitching in both leagues is the same. He's an NL pitcher.

Look at fucking Carlos Silva!

Man, I don't think anyone expects Vazquez to make it work in NY. Granted like Schill said, he could piece together some dominant starts, I just don't see him being consistent either.

That's gotta be rough on the guy, when the #5 starter is a #1 in the making. And he's right behind you.

[Machado]

I agree.

I figured he'd serviceable as the #4 guy, and certainly better than this. But he's just been BRUTAL.

He'll turn it around to an extent, but I really thought he'd win 12-14 games and post an ERA around 4 or so.. acceptable and desirable, really.

I don't think there's anybody with a brain that'll admit that pitching in both leagues is the same. He's an NL pitcher.

Look at fucking Carlos Silva!

Man, I don't think anyone expects Vazquez to make it work in NY. Granted like Schill said, he could piece together some dominant starts, I just don't see him being consistent either.

That's gotta be rough on the guy, when the #5 starter is a #1 in the making. And he's right behind you.

Either his mechanics are just terrible or he is basically afraid to pitch in the AL
Has to be one or the other.

[wickedsensation]

Look at fucking Carlos Silva!

I know! I was pissed when the Cubs first got him, but he's been pitching fairly well. Of course, that's mainly due to moving to the NL...

[JakeYonkel]

He's not dominating or anything, and it's only been a handful of starts... but the NL central probably has the weakest lineups in baseball. He could probably do decently.

For the record he's pitched against 3 shitty lineups out of his 4 starts.. Mets, Nationals, Reds, and Astros. So there ya go.

[Machado]

how did the giants score that many runs
vs halladay?
never saw that coming.

[killeverything]

how did the giants score that many runs
vs halladay?
never saw that coming.

Every once in a while the ( argueably ) best pitcher in baseball gets lit up. No one saw that coming. I would love to see a Halladay/Lincecum battle. Knowing our luck though, that will never happen. Just like the ( both healthy ) Schilling/RJ never did.

I gotta say. I love having Millah on MLBN. That guy is made for shit like this. He fits right in like Harold Reynolds.

Gotta say Jake. It surprises me that your friend had a bad experience meeting him. I'm sure that happens with everybody sometimes. I know a couple that met him and said he was great. Of course when they did, one was in 2003, the after was after 2004. So, that might have something to do with it.


It's crazy to see Zito find himself again. I wonder if we'll have another repeat of 2002? Where there was an ace that kicked his ass ( Pedro ), yet he won the Cy. Of course I have a hard time believing anyone will beat out Lincecum, except maybe Halladay......or ( it's early ) Jiminez.

[Funnelhead]

I would just like to chime in to say all of your teams are chumps and you should turn in your caps and get a Tampa Bay Rays hat....while there is still time to jump aboard the bandwagon. 15-5!

[SkyDog112046]

Kill - this will probably make you cringe: I overheard a conversation between a couple of women this morning while waiting to get my coffee. They were talking about how they can hardly wait for the warm weather and one of them said "It's not really summer until I get to go to Fenway and sing Sweet Caroline at the top of my lungs." I don't know about you, but I could live with a couple of 100 loss seasons if it would turn Fenway back into a baseball park instead of just a place to be seen.

[WhiteHouseSubsAC]

Wait until you guys see the catch that Marlon Byrd just made. I was actually laughing it was so ridiculous.

[Machado]

Over the last 10 games, the mets have made up
6 games on the phils.

[killeverything]

Kill - this will probably make you cringe: I overheard a conversation between a couple of women this morning while waiting to get my coffee. They were talking about how they can hardly wait for the warm weather and one of them said "It's not really summer until I get to go to Fenway and sing Sweet Caroline at the top of my lungs." I don't know about you, but I could live with a couple of 100 loss seasons if it would turn Fenway back into a baseball park instead of just a place to be seen.

It is what it is mang. I hate the whole "Red Sox Nation" thing. Bandwagon fans, etc. They weren't there until 2004.

Unless I'm back at Fenway, I won't wear my gear. Everyone who knows me, knows I actually have a fucking right. It's infuriating.

OTOH. Would you rather just not make it again? Going on 90+ years of being in everyone's ( MFY ) shadow. Or would you rather have confidence in your FO to build a team that follows Theo's philosophy of trying to win 95 a year, and make the Playoffs practically everyone of them? With that ratio, you're bound to win the WS some of those. Without dropping half a billion to literally buy a ring. Which would you rather be?

I hate the "pink hats". Hate em'. I love having a team without Clemen's choking in the big game. Macnamara fucking up a guaranteed win. Zimmer having anything to do with the management decisions. i don't care if they have a bad year. They'll build a compete next.

Funny thing is, is I blame most of the losses on the SP. Schilling said the exact same thing. Even without it, they're still a good team. Just that playing in the same Division as the defending World Champions, and Tampa playing out of their fucking minds right now. There is no room for mistakes. I think that's better for Baseball.

I'll still stand behind them until the season's over. I'm looking forward to the race between the Rays and MFY though. It would be fucking sweet if it was a three team race, but it's still fun to watch regardless.