Killeverything's (New)NeverEndingBaseballThread

[killeverything]

No matter what team he's on, 14 wins to me is NOT cy young worthy-unless he was 14-2 or 14-3 minimum

Do you know anyhing about bseball?

Why are you penalizing a guy for having a shitty bullpen and an offense that can't score runs?


Of his no-decisions:
May 21, 6 IP 2 R
May 31, 7 IP 3 R
Jun 11, 7.1 IP 3 R
Jul 18, 7 IP 1 R
Jul 29, 6 IP 2 R
Aug 14 7 IP 0 R
Sep 5 8 IP 0 R
Sep 11 7 IP 1 R

I count 8 games that he put his team into a position to win. Look at the 3 starts from August until September. Those aren't winnable games? You're going to count those against him because the Royals' offense is a joke???

Fuck, he had 2 losses that he went at least 7 IP and gave up 1 run. You're going to kill him for that?

You're looking at a guy, that if he pitched for a team with an offense, could EASILY have 22 wins at this point if not more.

Anybody that votes for Sabathia, Beckett, King Felix over this guy should have their voting privileges revoked.

Take it easy. You have your opinion, I have mine and the voters will have their opinion.

Who cares how many games his pen lost for him or who cares about any other "what ifs"

Stats are what people care about.
I'm just saying 14 wins to me(not league leading) is probably not enough
to get the Cy Young

Wins/Losses is the worst way to judge a pitcher. If the offense gets shut down by the opposing pitcher it's the starter's fault?

With all the stats out now DiPS, FiP. There are way's too see how a pitcher ( and only a pitcher does ). Looking at those numbers no one touches Greinke. The only one that's close ( and I don't consider him a Cy canidate ) is Lester.

2007 was practically the first time the BBWA got it right with the Cy voting, when they gave it to Sabbathia. Sure Beckett may have won 20, but Sabbathia won in every other catagory.

Keep in mind these are the same people that gave Clemens a Cy over RJ in '04. Zito a Cy over Pedro ( yeah, that Pedro ) in '02.

Wait your also the one that thinks NY owned Pedro when the BP would blow his leads.

[TawnyVonJagger]

If Chris Coghlan doesn't get NL ROY, I'll eat my fucking hat. Dude is leading all rookies in just about every offensive category, and he's currently 7th in the NL in batting avg. Oh, and he's had the most hits of ANY player since the ASB. Oh yeah, he's not bad in the field too.

The NL Cy Young will definitely go to Lincecum. They call him The Freak for a reason! Earlier, I would've thought JJ would've gotten some consideration, but he's just flat out getting tired now. (Sorry, Mrs. Itjogs) Still good, but losing his control a bit, and rarely goes past 6 innings now.

[killeverything]

If Chris Coghlan doesn't get NL ROY, I'll eat my fucking hat. Dude is leading all rookies in just about every offensive category, and he's currently 7th in the NL in batting avg. Oh, and he's had the most hits of ANY player since the ASB. Oh yeah, he's not bad in the field too.

The NL Cy Young will definitely go to Lincecum. They call him The Freak for a reason! Earlier, I would've thought JJ would've gotten some consideration, but he's just flat out getting tired now. (Sorry, Mrs. Itjogs) Still good, but losing his control a bit, and rarely goes past 6 innings now.

I agree. The problem with Lincecum is ( like Dontrelle ) scouts don't think his delivery will hold up for his entire career. I hope it does, because he's fucking awesome. It just goes against the norm of what many say. Who knows?

He's been a little hurt this season. He's so damn good though. I think he's got it on lock down.

The biggest question to me is the AL MVP. Of course Mauer should get it, but if he doesn't? The people saying "Jeter" are out of their fucking minds. He's not even the leader of OPS on his own team. He's tied with Cano.

Numbers wise Teixera isn't one of the leaders, but he's having a fucking insanse season. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out. Unfortunately the two deserving canidates for the AL MVP and Cy Young play on teams that aren't League Leaders.

[killeverything]

There's all kinds of stuff to talk about. Like Rivera's blown save against Sweeney, and his walkoff to Ichiro, King Felix beating "ace" pitcher Burnett.

But I came across this from Schilling. I thought it was a very well written piece, that should be posted here.

Nineteen years ago Shonda and I met a man named Dick Bergeron. Dick had been recently diagnosed with ALS (amyotrophic lateral sclerosis), better known as Lou Gehrig’s Disease.

ALS, today, is still 100 percent fatal. However, in the past 19 years Lou’s name has gained notoriety and recognition in many positive ways.

His life story has been written about many times over. This is the best book I’ve ever read on it. ( has an Amazon link to 'The Luckiest Man. Life and Times Of Lou Gehrig' - Kill )

Why is this relevant? For two reasons, really. The first was the nation becoming aware of Lou during the previous decade, when Cal Ripken broke Lou’s consecutive game streak. Cal did it with a blue collar work ethic unmatched in anyone I ever played with. Knowing Cal’s father, it was easy to see how and why he was who he was.

The second reason occurred this past weekend. On a rain-soaked evening in the new Yankee Stadium, Derek Jeter lined an opposite-field single for career hit No. 2,722 and became the all-time hits leader for the New York Yankee franchise. The event got some good PR and some decent coverage, but it’s far more significant than the coverage it’s been given, to me anyway. This isn’t the Nationals or Padres we’re talking about, this is one of sports’ oldest franchises and home of the game’s greatest all-time players.

Red Sox fans are pretty much in agreement that Jeter is a player they love to “not like.” I don’t say hate because real Sox fans — dyed-in-the-wool Sox Nation members — can’t hate the guy. You can dislike him immensely, and much of that is due to the pinstripes, but there is nothing we know of that would give pause, rhyme or reason to not having immense respect for what he’s done on and off the field.

His early career was marked by trend-setting numbers at a position defined by defense for the past century. Well, that and four World Series rings in his first week or two in the big leagues, it seemed.

But beyond that there are two things that stand out to me.

Derek Jeter has always been above the fray. As someone who’s wallowed in it, “foot-in-mouthed” it hundreds of times, said dumb things and backed up dumber ones, it’s refreshing. He’s shown up, played, and turned in a first-ballot Hall of Fame career in the hardest environment in sports to do any/all of the above.

That, in and of itself, is an accomplishment.

More importantly to me, though, was this. I enjoyed competing against him as much as anyone I ever faced. Derek was that guy who was going to hit his way, regardless, with enough talent to still get hits when you made your pitch and hit your spot. One of my favorite memories was stepping onto the rubber for Game 7 of the 2001 World Series, being as locked in as I’ve ever been, looking into home plate and looking into his eyes, and us smiling at each other, knowing what we were getting ready to experience. By the way, I should never have thrown the fastball away in the seventh inning, I had him if I’d just kept pounding the ball in …

I have no idea how he felt about competing against me, or about me as a player, but I know competing against that guy, for the decade or so we matched up, was what made the Major Leagues the Major Leagues for someone like me.

So, congratulations Derek, you earned every ounce of respect and accolades thrown your way, and you’re one of the few men I ever competed against who is worthy of having his name mentioned with the same reverence and respect as Lou Gehrig.

[SkyDog112046]

Not really much drama left in the AL races with Detroit winning today. If the Twins had won I think the Tigers may have folded, but they should hang on now.

Boston wins and Texas loses, so the Red Sox are up by 8 in the wild card with 14 left to go. Anyone not named Zimmer won't blow that lead.

So to open the playoffs it's looking like:
NY vs Det
Bos vs LA

Any thoughts on those series?

[JakeYonkel]

I'll do my annual playoff prediction write-ups in about a week when the matchups are set.

But it looks like, barring a Detroit collapse, the AL is set, and barring a Colorado collapse, the NL is set. So we'll see.

[killeverything]

Premature ejacuplayoffs motherfuckers. Have you looked at the AL East?

The Yankees only have a four game lead in the loss column with a series against Anaheim and The Red Hot Red Sox. This is far from over.

It's still possible for the Mighty Red Sox to overtake the Division, your right about that. Aside from embarassing the MFY. I don't really see the point.

I would prefer to give the starters all some time off, to gear up for the Playoffs. As it's approaching now Beckett and Lester are approaching career highs for IP. The Division would be sweet, but not as sweet as a rested dominating 1-4 in the rotation.

Still it's almost locked down. I believe all the MFY needs in one win, or a Texas loss at Oakland. I'm liking the pitching the Mighty Red Sox have.

Oh yeah, @ Joba The Fat's 3IP 6ER.

[Machado]

Don't even get me started with Joba.
What makes matters worse, is he seems to be the only person that has not yet accepted there is so much room for improvement.
I would copy and paste his quotes, but what's the point.
7 runs in 2 innings to the lowly mariners.
He grooved a fastball to junior and saw it fly out of the park.

Something is not quite right.
Either he is injured or he is over confident.

[killeverything]

Don't even get me started with Joba.
What makes matters worse, is he seems to be the only person that has not yet accepted there is so much room for improvement.
I would copy and paste his quotes, but what's the point.
7 runs in 2 innings to the lowly mariners.
He grooved a fastball to junior and saw it fly out of the park.

Something is not quite right.
Either he is injured or he is over confident.

Or maybe having two pitches ( one of which the velocity has declined and isn't ranked as a + pitch anymore ), doesn't make a dominant starter.

[Machado]

Don't even get me started with Joba.
What makes matters worse, is he seems to be the only person that has not yet accepted there is so much room for improvement.
I would copy and paste his quotes, but what's the point.
7 runs in 2 innings to the lowly mariners.
He grooved a fastball to junior and saw it fly out of the park.

Something is not quite right.
Either he is injured or he is over confident.

Or maybe having two pitches ( one of which the velocity has declined and isn't ranked as a + pitch anymore ), doesn't make a dominant starter.

There are nights when Joba throws up to 95 and then other nights when he hovers around 90-91.
Eiland has never explained how this happens or why. Joba(as far as I know) has not explained this as well.
There are many successful starters that have pitched around 90-91, but those hurlers also have a + 2nd pitch and maybe even a + 3rd pitch.
Right now Joba is basically an average/below average starter.
Post all-star break he was dominating. Once going 8 innings in atlanta.
What the heck happened???

[killeverything]

Don't even get me started with Joba.
What makes matters worse, is he seems to be the only person that has not yet accepted there is so much room for improvement.
I would copy and paste his quotes, but what's the point.
7 runs in 2 innings to the lowly mariners.
He grooved a fastball to junior and saw it fly out of the park.

Something is not quite right.
Either he is injured or he is over confident.

Or maybe having two pitches ( one of which the velocity has declined and isn't ranked as a + pitch anymore ), doesn't make a dominant starter.

There are nights when Joba throws up to 95 and then other nights when he hovers around 90-91.
Eiland has never explained how this happens or why. Joba(as far as I know) has not explained this as well.
There are many successful starters that have pitched around 90-91, but those hurlers also have a + 2nd pitch and maybe even a + 3rd pitch.
Right now Joba is basically an average/below average starter.
Post all-star break he was dominating. Once going 8 innings in atlanta.
What the heck happened???

If your going to get by at 90-91, you need to have pinpoint control ( ala Greg Maddux/Curt Schilling ). Or you need to have a deceptive delivery/release point ( ala Pedro Martinez/Ed Lopat ). It doesn't matter his mph. These are Major League hitters. They can crush a 98mph heater.

I'm not saying he's tipping his pitches, but to go a full QS. He doesn't have the stuff for it. If a batter is sitting on what you throwing, you better be able to control it like Rivera with his cutter.

Here's goes the rhetoric. Joba is better suited for the pen. I'm a Hughes fan, always will be. That guy can be the real deal. Chamberlain, I just don't see it happening.

[Machado]

Joba is doing all he can to have the finger pointed at him.
Compared to Hughes, Joba is not performing at all and at the pace he is going, Ian Kennedy might replace him at some point during the playoffs.
I know, that is a bit much, but Kennedy is back on the team and will pitch several times before the season is over.

Joba is going in the wrong direction.
Yes the Yankees have had to alter their Joba rules several times in '09.
That is being done for his own good. You just can't place a 160 innings limit on the kid and ask him to make 30 starts in a season with that limit.

Where is the heat?
What happened to the nasty slider?
The great curve?

[killeverything]

They fucked him up.

Possibly.

I don't know how you can verify it. I highly doubt he was high in PAP ( Pitcher Abuse Points ), even then it's the old-school vs. the new school on if it is actually a verifiable way to groom a pitcher.

Regardless. I still see Joba as being useful as a set-up man, possibly heir to Rivera.

I sound like a broken record I know, I still think having Hughes is going to be the big deal for the MFY pitching staff in the future. I never bought into the Joba hype personally.

[tin00can]

At the risk of creating a whammy, I'd like to welcome the Yankees back to Angel Stadium in lovely Anaheim, CA. The Angels always enjoy it when the Yankees visit and hate to see them leave. It's like a panacea for their baseball ills. It never gets old. Never.

One down, two to go.

[tin00can]

Joba is doing all he can to have the finger pointed at him.
Compared to Hughes, Joba is not performing at all and at the pace he is going, Ian Kennedy might replace him at some point during the playoffs.
I know, that is a bit much, but Kennedy is back on the team and will pitch several times before the season is over.

Joba is going in the wrong direction.
Yes the Yankees have had to alter their Joba rules several times in '09.
That is being done for his own good. You just can't place a 160 innings limit on the kid and ask him to make 30 starts in a season with that limit.

Where is the heat?
What happened to the nasty slider?
The great curve?

Jesus christ, I've never heard so much bullshit for one pitcher before. Seriously - fuck the Yankees and their self-important "Joba rules," like this guy is the most important prospect ever. Every time I hear "Joba rules" I want to punch a nun right in the cunt. They've handled him with kid gloves and he still can't cut it. Shut up about him already. If he wasn't on the Yankees he'd just be another prospect who isn't panning out.

Fuck Joba, fuck the Joba rules, and fuck the media for continuing with this crap.

And yes, I know I'm giving attention to something I'm bitching about attention being given to. Fuck you if you want to point that out!

[Machado]

At the risk of creating a whammy, I'd like to welcome the Yankees back to Angel Stadium in lovely Anaheim, CA. The Angels always enjoy it when the Yankees visit and hate to see them leave. It's like a panacea for their baseball ills. It never gets old. Never.

One down, two to go.

Curse of Walt Disney in that fucking park.

[JakeYonkel]

At the risk of creating a whammy, I'd like to welcome the Yankees back to Angel Stadium in lovely Anaheim, CA. The Angels always enjoy it when the Yankees visit and hate to see them leave. It's like a panacea for their baseball ills. It never gets old. Never.

One down, two to go.

I hate hate hate hate the Angels! UNBEATABLE.

By the same token, LA can't win in Boston.

With any luck it'll be a NY-Boston ALCS, that'll be fun. The Tigers are boring and I don't want any part of the Angels.

[JakeYonkel]

Jesus christ, I've never heard so much bullshit for one pitcher before. Seriously - fuck the Yankees and their self-important "Joba rules," like this guy is the most important prospect ever. Every time I hear "Joba rules" I want to punch a nun right in the cunt. They've handled him with kid gloves and he still can't cut it. Shut up about him already. If he wasn't on the Yankees he'd just be another prospect who isn't panning out.

Fuck Joba, fuck the Joba rules, and fuck the media for continuing with this crap.

And yes, I know I'm giving attention to something I'm bitching about attention being given to. Fuck you if you want to point that out!

The best part about this is how much of a dumb fuck Joba is, too. He has been routinely getting lit up for weeks and after every start he says something to the tune of "I'm pitching well" or "I feel confident out there."

Yeah, he's shown a few flashes of excellence. No argument there. But then again, plenty of scrubby guys have the occasional 7 inning, 1 run game too.

Fucking put him in the bullpen already, let him thrown 25 pitches at 110% effort every other day, and hope Phil Hughes can be more effective in the rotation than Joba is. I think Hughes will do OK, he's building confidence and has a bit more than the overpowering fastball/slider combo that Joba does. And he doesn't nibble or shake off Posada every other pitch.

The scary thing is that at this point Chad Gaudin is the #4 starter.

[killeverything]

Jesus christ, I've never heard so much bullshit for one pitcher before. Seriously - fuck the Yankees and their self-important "Joba rules," like this guy is the most important prospect ever. Every time I hear "Joba rules" I want to punch a nun right in the cunt. They've handled him with kid gloves and he still can't cut it. Shut up about him already. If he wasn't on the Yankees he'd just be another prospect who isn't panning out.

Fuck Joba, fuck the Joba rules, and fuck the media for continuing with this crap.

And yes, I know I'm giving attention to something I'm bitching about attention being given to. Fuck you if you want to point that out!

The best part about this is how much of a dumb fuck Joba is, too. He has been routinely getting lit up for weeks and after every start he says something to the tune of "I'm pitching well" or "I feel confident out there."

Yeah, he's shown a few flashes of excellence. No argument there. But then again, plenty of scrubby guys have the occasional 7 inning, 1 run game too.

Fucking put him in the bullpen already, let him thrown 25 pitches at 110% effort every other day, and hope Phil Hughes can be more effective in the rotation than Joba is. I think Hughes will do OK, he's building confidence and has a bit more than the overpowering fastball/slider combo that Joba does. And he doesn't nibble or shake off Posada every other pitch.

The scary thing is that at this point Chad Gaudin is the #4 starter.

Is that really any scarier than Joba as the #4?

[Machado]

The way Joba is performing now, Chad is giving him competition for
that #4 starter. If Joba believes he is a sure thing in the 1st round of the playoffs, he better wake the fuck up already.
Girardi had this to say about Joba yesterday:

Girardi reacted to Joba Chamberlain’s comments by saying that the right-hander does in fact need to pitch better, whether he says so in public or not. A few minutes later, Girardi mentioned that Chad Gaudin could work his way onto the postseason roster.
“I think that at times any one can be in some form of denial. What he tells you and what he says to us can be two different things. Players are positive people and they’re confident people. But there is no doubt about it: Joba needs to pitch better. He knows that. He’ll be the first one to tell you he knows that.

“One or two bad pitches usually doesn’t lead to seven runs unless there’s some errors or funny things that happen. That was not the game he’s capable of pitching. We need him to pitch much better this weekend.”

[JakeYonkel]

I now give the edge to the Yankees, because out of the three teams, they won't have to beat the other two to make it to the series.

Good point. But don't forget the one-and-dones in '05, '06, and '07 against LA, Detroit, and Cleveland. Anything can happen in a short series and the recent lack of success might be in some of their heads. You know it's in A-Rod's.

[Machado]

Here is a funny Mantle/Billy Martin story
that I read on a Yankees blog and had to share:




Mickey took Billy Martin hunting one day in Oklahoma and told him to wait in the car while he went and asked a friend of his who was a farmer for permission to hunt on his land.

The farmer agreed, but asked Mickey for a favor. He had an old cow that needed putting down and asked Mickey to do it for him because he didn’t have the heart to. So Mickey decided to play a trick on Billy.

Mickey came back to the car, pretended he was mad and got his rifle. “That son of a gun won’t let us hunt,” he said. “I’m going to shoot his cow.”

So Mantle when into the barn with Billy trailing behind. Bang! He shot the cow dead.

Suddenly he heard two more shots. Bang! Bang!

He turned around and there was Billy with a smoking rifle. “I got two of his horses, Mick,” he said. “That’ll show him.”

[killeverything]

The Yankees are only throwing three starters out there for the first round. Joba will be on the roster, possibly to come out of the bullpen. Joba's upside is way to high to consider benching him for a guy who even when he pitches well, can't get out of the fifth, if the Yankees make it to the second round.

That being said, I feel better about taking the division. Magic number is six, with yankees having 10 games and the Red Sox 12. That loss two nights ago seemed to end The Red Sox hope of taking the division.

I now give the edge to the Yankees, because out of the three teams, they won't have to beat the other two to make it to the series.

I wouldn't be overly confident. The MFY will have to face either LAAAAAAAAAA or Boston. With basically just Sabbathia, when faced with a good pitcher ( rested Boston staff ) that run-support won't mean too much.

I wasn't too concerned with the Division, and from recent comments Tito wasn't either. I would rather give the starters some extra rest. It's about the WS, not Division. Beckett is on record saying he'd like a little time to rest up before the Playoffs. I believe Lester is too. I'm extrememly confident in pitching.

As for the Kansas series? Well the Greinke game is a guaranteed loss, that much is certain. It's funny because in Kansas the Mighty Red Sox's record in 14-16......hey at least the ALDS ain't there.

The Playoffs this year will be awesome. There is no clear favorite.

Let's go Mighty Red Sox!!!!!!!!

[SkyDog112046]

Zack Greinke toyed with Boston last night. He has not allowed an earned run in his past 5 starts, which included 3 of the AL playoff teams in Detroit, LA, and Boston.

I saw an interesting stat: In Greinke's 8 losses he has only been given 13 runs in support. With just average run support he should easily have 21 or 22 wins. He'll be close to unanimous for the CY, he should get all the 1st place votes except from the idiot that writes for the NY Post.

[JakeYonkel]

Please, CC has more of a case than King Felix, but if anybody's going to get a token vote it'll be Hernandez.

[Machado]

I am also keeping an even keel.
The red sox put the fear in me for reasons we all know.
Same goes for the angels.
Both teams have enjoyed much success vs us.

As for the tigers/twins, anybody with 1/2 a brain would say the twins are the easier match-up of the 2.

[killeverything]

I am also keeping an even keel.
The red sox put the fear in me for reasons we all know.
Same goes for the angels.
Both teams have enjoyed much success vs us.

As for the tigers/twins, anybody with 1/2 a brain would say the twins are the easier match-up of the 2.

See, you would think, but historically speaking "no".

Minnesota is one of the team's ( much like Seattle for the most part ) that just can't beat the MFY. Even at the Metrodome with Santana and Liriano. I don't care how much of a genius Gardenhire is, they just always choke come Playoffs.

I would think Detroit has a better chance with their #1 and 2, but even then....there is the no run support and Rodney waiting in the BP.

As for the MFY/Boston potential ALCS. I think that series more than any other will be about pitching. Offensively NY has an edge, same with defense. I think it will all come down to who's on the mound. In that respect I think Boston has a SLIGHT edge. But really who knows?

[Machado]

Just took 2 of 3 vs the angels. Plus, Ian Kennedy protected a 1 run lead in the 8th.
Nice to see him back in action after surgery a few months ago.
Since Hughes was unavailable, Giradi did not have many options in the 8th.

Nice to win a series in anaheim. When was the last time we did that? Believe me, I don't want to look that up.

[JakeYonkel]

"You're" apparently on the team, "you" should know.

[TawnyVonJagger]

The Fightin' Fish do it again!! WAY TO GO BRAD LIDGE!!!!

Philthy Nation was particularly obnoxious tonight, so it was so fucking fun shutting those pricks up. Heh. The Phils definitely won't get far in the playoffs with that pen. Love it. Well worth the 45 minute rain delay!

LETS GO FISH!!! Goddamn, I love these guys!