We need to talk about Hot in the Shade. (Yes. We do.)

[Tyketto Meniketti]

At the time, it didn't feel like they marketed the tune correctly. 1) As noted above, it had the Michael Bolton connection, so it needed to be pushed hard to top 40 radio. It did pretty well in my market, but it didn't have the Cinderella, Kix-type power ballad push at the time where it was all over T40 radio.

It felt more like "I Won't Forget You" a few years prior... popular but not a blockbuster. They should've pushed it to the middle age haus fraus who loved Bolton.

On the other hand, it had a good video, Carr's drums were very solid, and Kulick ripped a pretty strong acoustic solo in it. So, it was a ballad that wasn't all sappy, like the aforementioned "Don't Know What You Got," or Nelson, White Lion, etc.

In summary, it was a marketing problem. And, timing wise, Kiss had yet to become nostalgia with the haus fraus, which carried them in the late 90s and on.

[Tyketto Meniketti]

Were fans excited with the Rise To It video because Paul and Gene were putting on the facepaint?

Not particularly. It was kinda cool as a novelty but we all thought they just looked weird. I was never into the music much past LIU, but HITS is almost universally considered among their worst albums.

Bruce did like and shared this remix I did a few months ago by request.

KISS - "Turn On The Night" (franKENstein Remix and Video Redux w/Piano)
https://youtu.be/_82h-SWdMnE

Interesting. I'll be honest, you're messing with a pop metal masterpiece. I think "Turn On The Night" is one of the catchiest tunes of the entire era.

Gave your take a first listen:
1. I could not like the opening any less.
2. The added piano is quite noticeable, but the odd transition (2:14) to Kulick's solo is jarring, so is the one at 2:43. All the piano has a very 80s AOR feel to it. Can't quite put a comparable tune to it, but something yacht rock-ish. Maybe it's Mellencamp's (Johnny Cougar at the time) "I Need A Lover," I dunno.
3. Don't like Paul's closing repeats from 3:41 on.

Sorry, man, I appreciate what you do! But, again, the original is near perfection.

[kanister]

Wow, is this correct? NONE of the songs from the 80's hit the top 40???? That shocks the hell out of me if that's really true. That should sum it all up right there. People were not buying Kiss albums. "Forever" must've just been a big radio request song.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forever_( ... ng)#Charts
"Forever" peaked at number 8 on the Billboard Hot 100 chart on April 21, 1990, making it the group's first US Top 40 single since "I Was Made for Lovin' You" reached number 11 in 1979. It was the band's ninth and, to date, last Top 40 American single. It also reached number 17 on Billboard's Hot Mainstream Rock Tracks on March 17, 1990.

I've always wondered if Kiss had any actual hit singles in US. Yeah we have heard Beth got an award and songs like Christine Sixteen and Calling Dr Love were Top-40. But does an average person know any Kiss song? In Europe many people know I Was Made Loving You but probably wouldn't`know who it is by. And there are national single hits like Crazy Crazy Nights in UK and Heaven`s on Fire in Nordic countries.

Kiss didn't have mega selling albums either so it's kind of funny some of us Kisstards believe they sold 100 million records worldwide. If you think about it it`s probably more like half of that number.

[Earl Skakel]

My opinion: they really hurt themselves with the audience when doing "Let's Put the X in Sex" the year before. Not only was it a pretty bad song, but it was "cringe-y." I was graduating high school around that time, and I remember having gotten back into Kiss with Lick It Up (also cringe-y), Animalize, and Asylum. Asylum might have been best of those. But I thought "Let's Put the X" was just so ridiculously stupid that it put me back off of them. They finally went a step too far.

Agree but let's also not forget the gem You Make Me Rock Hard where the video might be the most cringe worthy thing KISS ever did and yes I know what I'm saying. I mean Paul sucking on his fingers taking the glove off GTFOH

[Tyketto Meniketti]

Wow, is this correct? NONE of the songs from the 80's hit the top 40???? That shocks the hell out of me if that's really true. That should sum it all up right there. People were not buying Kiss albums. "Forever" must've just been a big radio request song.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forever_( ... ng)#Charts
"Forever" peaked at number 8 on the Billboard Hot 100 chart on April 21, 1990, making it the group's first US Top 40 single since "I Was Made for Lovin' You" reached number 11 in 1979. It was the band's ninth and, to date, last Top 40 American single. It also reached number 17 on Billboard's Hot Mainstream Rock Tracks on March 17, 1990.

I've always wondered if Kiss had any actual hit singles in US. Yeah we have heard Beth got an award and songs like Christine Sixteen and Calling Dr Love were Top-40. But does an average person know any Kiss song? In Europe many people know I Was Made Loving You but probably wouldn't`know who it is by. And there are national single hits like Crazy Crazy Nights in UK and Heaven`s on Fire in Nordic countries.

Kiss didn't have mega selling albums either so it's kind of funny some of us Kisstards believe they sold 100 million records worldwide. If you think about it it`s probably more like half of that number.

There's isn't a human on earth that doesn't know RNRAN is Kiss. Christine Sixteen and Dr Love were never hits. Nowhere near as popular as Heaven's On Fire, Crazy Nights, Forever, Domino, IWMFLY. Even Detroit RC, Hide Your Heart, among quite a few others, were more popular on radio than Christine Sixteen ever could be.

[Demon Kogure]

Mark Slaughter was 25 when "Angels" came out
Jani Lane was 24 when "Heaven" came out
Bach was 21 when "I Remember You" came out
Paul and Gene were 37 and 40 when "Forever" came out

It ain't hard to figure out what happened there. Chicks don't plaster their bedrooms with posters of guys who are older than their dads

[DangerZone]

Huey saying fly to the angels is not ghey but heaven is is silly.

As far as “forever,” what I noticed about it was all the other hit ballads had strummy campfire chords (heaven, I remember you, every rose, ballad of Jayne…)
Forever was a lot of chordal movement so I think that kept it from classic level. Also the drums came in too early

As far as the album and sales - I think only kisstards care anything about Kiss.
I think the common person recognizes the long tongue clown but that’s it.
Their music has never had any crossover appeal

[risingfarce]

It was written by Michael Bolton and Stanley at the height of Bolton's powers. His sound was THE template for the soft-rock/adult contemporary format, no surprise it scored a good chart position.

But was there any overlap between Kiss' target audience and Michael Bolton? Hell no. So the song breaking the top-ten didn't result in any actual units moved. Adult contemporary fans weren't going to go out and buy a Kiss album, and 13 year old boys weren't going to go out and buy a record because of a Michal Bolton power ballad.

Paul made a statement about "Forever", saying that he and Michael Bolton met only once to try writing a song. The song wasn't finished. For whatever reason, the two never worked further on the song. Paul finished the song. When Bolton wanted to perform the song, he wrote to either Paul or KISS' management to get a copy of the lyrics. Paul said that he wrote the majority of the song. Don't know who wrote what.

[Wiseacre]

As far as the album and sales - I think only kisstards care anything about Kiss.
I think the common person recognizes the long tongue clown but that’s it.
Their music has never had any crossover appeal

Sad but true

[Hatchets Molly]

As far as the album and sales - I think only kisstards care anything about Kiss.
I think the common person recognizes the long tongue clown but that’s it.
Their music has never had any crossover appeal

Aside from Beth and RnRAN, the general appeal has never been there. In contrast, I'm not sure I've heard a full Taylor Swift song, but I could give the titles of several.

In hindsight, back to the 70s, KISS' appeal was to kids (like comic books and cartoons) or dummies who thought they were shocking and dangerous. That made up the Army. They couldn't rise to the level of other bands in the 80s.

Everything you say is true. I was a tard from 5th grade (around 76) to just after Y2K. It was as if someone had flipped a switch. I couldn't take it anymore.

EDIT: Of course, I'm not saying something no one already knows. Not meant to be a history lesson.

[FreddyFender]

It was written by Michael Bolton and Stanley at the height of Bolton's powers. His sound was THE template for the soft-rock/adult contemporary format, no surprise it scored a good chart position.

But was there any overlap between Kiss' target audience and Michael Bolton? Hell no. So the song breaking the top-ten didn't result in any actual units moved. Adult contemporary fans weren't going to go out and buy a Kiss album, and 13 year old boys weren't going to go out and buy a record because of a Michal Bolton power ballad.

Paul made a statement about "Forever", saying that he and Michael Bolton met only once to try writing a song. The song wasn't finished. For whatever reason, the two never worked further on the song. Paul finished the song. When Bolton wanted to perform the song, he wrote to either Paul or KISS' management to get a copy of the lyrics. Paul said that he wrote the majority of the song. Don't know who wrote what.

You believe things that Paul Stanley says?

It sure sounds like a Michael Bolton song.

[DonJuanDeMarco]

It was written by Michael Bolton and Stanley at the height of Bolton's powers. His sound was THE template for the soft-rock/adult contemporary format, no surprise it scored a good chart position.

But was there any overlap between Kiss' target audience and Michael Bolton? Hell no. So the song breaking the top-ten didn't result in any actual units moved. Adult contemporary fans weren't going to go out and buy a Kiss album, and 13 year old boys weren't going to go out and buy a record because of a Michal Bolton power ballad.

Paul made a statement about "Forever", saying that he and Michael Bolton met only once to try writing a song. The song wasn't finished. For whatever reason, the two never worked further on the song. Paul finished the song. When Bolton wanted to perform the song, he wrote to either Paul or KISS' management to get a copy of the lyrics. Paul said that he wrote the majority of the song. Don't know who wrote what.

You believe things that Paul Stanley says?

It sure sounds like a Michael Bolton song.

Michael actually played the song live in recent years. When he was asked how he wrote the song with Paul Stanley he said "Paul...was in the room".

[Chip Z'Hoy]

A lot of data to go over here. Here's where I landed, a combo of JJL, Kogure, and Freddy.

- Kiss fans already bought the album. They hit their sales ceiling.

- Teen girls weren't going to put posters of Kiss on their wall. Sorry, Gener.

- No crossover. As Freddy pointed out, the song had soft rock appeal but that audience was never going to buy a Kiss album.

[daveg]

Paul made a statement about "Forever", saying that he and Michael Bolton met only once to try writing a song. The song wasn't finished. For whatever reason, the two never worked further on the song. Paul finished the song. When Bolton wanted to perform the song, he wrote to either Paul or KISS' management to get a copy of the lyrics. Paul said that he wrote the majority of the song. Don't know who wrote what.

You believe things that Paul Stanley says?

It sure sounds like a Michael Bolton song.

Michael actually played the song live in recent years. When he was asked how he wrote the song with Paul Stanley he said "Paul...was in the room".

If you ever get a chance to listen to an interview, or podcast with Bolton..I'd highly recomment checking it out. Dude is funny as hell, and has amazing stories.

[NeonKnite]

All those other albums mentioned at the top of the thread had more good songs on them.

HITS is an album full of bad demos. Most of it sounds nothing like KISS. And while KISS has had albums that are not their "sound" (Elder, COS) at least they had quality songwriting at their core. Other than a few songs on this album, it's a complete shitfest. It's like someone told them "Hey Crazy Nights is your worst album." And they responded with "Hold my beer."

Slide guitar on a KISS album? So fucking dumb. They were lost again.

[Indy_Rob]

Am I the only one that actually liked "Little Caesar" on that album? Haven't heard it since probably 1990 but I recall liking it.

[Chip Z'Hoy]

All those other albums mentioned at the top of the thread had more good songs on them.

I think you might've made a good point here. The whole point of the rocker-ballad 1-2 punch was that the ballad comes out and combined with the strength of the lead single, the consumer pulls the trigger. Basically "18 & Life" comes out (ballad-ish) and I go "This song's great, 'Youth Gone Wild' was great too, I'll buy this." Warrant had "Down Boys," Slaughter had "Up All Night," Yankees had "Coming of Age."

If the "Hide Your Heart" video was ever played, I never saw it.

[Tyketto Meniketti]

Am I the only one that actually liked "Little Caesar" on that album? Haven't heard it since probably 1990 but I recall liking it.

No. I don't get the hate for HITS. It had some catchy tunes on it. Little Caesar's one of them. Yeah, production. But to some degree the production really fits.

[Chip Z'Hoy]

No. I don't get the hate for HITS. It had some catchy tunes on it. Little Caesar's one of them. Yeah, production. But to some degree the production really fits.

If they shaved 5 songs off, it'd just be a normal mediocre 80's Kiss album--2 or 3 singles, a couple okay deep cuts, and filler.

It's my least favorite Kiss album because it's exhausting to listen to, not to mention pretty front-loaded. Once "Hide Your Heart" is over, you're in for an endurance test.

[NeonKnite]

The album was so poor... they knew it... that they had to resort to a cheap, half assed attempt putting on the make-up again in hopes of garnering interest.

[kanister]

Wow, is this correct? NONE of the songs from the 80's hit the top 40???? That shocks the hell out of me if that's really true. That should sum it all up right there. People were not buying Kiss albums. "Forever" must've just been a big radio request song.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forever_( ... ng)#Charts
"Forever" peaked at number 8 on the Billboard Hot 100 chart on April 21, 1990, making it the group's first US Top 40 single since "I Was Made for Lovin' You" reached number 11 in 1979. It was the band's ninth and, to date, last Top 40 American single. It also reached number 17 on Billboard's Hot Mainstream Rock Tracks on March 17, 1990.

I've always wondered if Kiss had any actual hit singles in US. Yeah we have heard Beth got an award and songs like Christine Sixteen and Calling Dr Love were Top-40. But does an average person know any Kiss song? In Europe many people know I Was Made Loving You but probably wouldn't`know who it is by. And there are national single hits like Crazy Crazy Nights in UK and Heaven`s on Fire in Nordic countries.

Kiss didn't have mega selling albums either so it's kind of funny some of us Kisstards believe they sold 100 million records worldwide. If you think about it it`s probably more like half of that number.

There's isn't a human on earth that doesn't know RNRAN is Kiss. Christine Sixteen and Dr Love were never hits. Nowhere near as popular as Heaven's On Fire, Crazy Nights, Forever, Domino, IWMFLY. Even Detroit RC, Hide Your Heart, among quite a few others, were more popular on radio than Christine Sixteen ever could be.

Sorry I´m continuing on the off topic track. I believe the RARAN thing when it comes to USA, but that song is pretty obscure outside the fan circles in Europe. Reason I bought up Christine and Dr Love is that they actually went into Top-40 and it made me wonder if some people actually know those songs. Between IWMFLY and Forever they didn`t have a single Top-40 "hit" but yes I believe the songs you mentioned are more recognised now. Europe tends to lean more into 80`s Kiss so that is even more true here.

Still feels like they didn`t really have an international crossover hit other than IWMLY. Very few short stints in the Top-10 single charts anywhere in the world. Kiss got a lot of mileage out of being a popular live music phenomenon and teen heroes 1975-1978.

[Love_Industry]

Still feels like they didn`t really have an international crossover hit other than IWMLY. Very few short stints in the Top-10 single charts anywhere in the world. Kiss got a lot of mileage out of being a popular live music phenomenon and teen heroes 1975-1978.

Lick It Up and Heaven's On Fire are pretty well known among those who were teenagers in the 80s in most of Europe. On the other hand, only complete Kisstards know Beth over here.

[risingfarce]

Paul made a statement about "Forever", saying that he and Michael Bolton met only once to try writing a song. The song wasn't finished. For whatever reason, the two never worked further on the song. Paul finished the song. When Bolton wanted to perform the song, he wrote to either Paul or KISS' management to get a copy of the lyrics. Paul said that he wrote the majority of the song. Don't know who wrote what.

You believe things that Paul Stanley says?

It sure sounds like a Michael Bolton song.

Michael actually played the song live in recent years. When he was asked how he wrote the song with Paul Stanley he said "Paul...was in the room".

Bolton didn't sing it in concert:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUzcgqymFeA

[Hatchets Molly]

[Mister Freeze]

Still feels like they didn`t really have an international crossover hit other than IWMLY. Very few short stints in the Top-10 single charts anywhere in the world. Kiss got a lot of mileage out of being a popular live music phenomenon and teen heroes 1975-1978.

Lick It Up and Heaven's On Fire are pretty well known among those who were teenagers in the 80s in most of Europe. On the other hand, only complete Kisstards know Beth over here.

"Beth" may have been their biggest hit when it was current, but it barely stuck around. "Heaven's On Fire" and "Lick It Up" aged better and still get play. I'd call those two bigger overall hits, despite not charting in the top-40 (and the way Billboard ranks that stuff is dubious, even back in the '80s).

Just checked the top streamed Kiss songs on Spotify...

1. I Was Made For Lovin' You
2. Rock and Roll All Nite
3. Detroit Rock City
4. Heaven's On Fire
5. Lick It Up
6. Love Gun
7. Forever
8. Strutter
9. Crazy Crazy Nights
10. Beth

That looks about right to me. The only surprise is "Strutter" being that high. Although it's the first song on a "Kiss - Greatest Hits" playlist that pops up at the top. People probably get curious, give Kiss a chance, listen to the first song and say that's enough.

Side note: My autocorrect tried to change "Nite" to "Night". It doesn't understand how we roll.

[pieceofme]

Still feels like they didn`t really have an international crossover hit other than IWMLY. Very few short stints in the Top-10 single charts anywhere in the world. Kiss got a lot of mileage out of being a popular live music phenomenon and teen heroes 1975-1978.

Lick It Up and Heaven's On Fire are pretty well known among those who were teenagers in the 80s in most of Europe. On the other hand, only complete Kisstards know Beth over here.

"Beth" may have been their biggest hit when it was current, but it barely stuck around. "Heaven's On Fire" and "Lick It Up" aged better and still get play. I'd call those two bigger overall hits, despite not charting in the top-40 (and the way Billboard ranks that stuff is dubious, even back in the '80s).

Just checked the top streamed Kiss songs on Spotify...

1. I Was Made For Lovin' You
2. Rock and Roll All Nite
3. Detroit Rock City
4. Heaven's On Fire
5. Lick It Up
6. Love Gun
7. Forever
8. Strutter
9. Crazy Crazy Nights
10. Beth

That looks about right to me. The only surprise is "Strutter" being that high. Although it's the first song on a "Kiss - Greatest Hits" playlist that pops up at the top. People probably get curious, give Kiss a chance, listen to the first song and say that's enough.

Side note: My autocorrect tried to change "Nite" to "Night". It doesn't understand how we roll.

Yeah if you don't like Strutter you're not going to like KISS. It is on of their top 3 songs imo.

[TREVERLAST]

Still feels like they didn`t really have an international crossover hit other than IWMLY. Very few short stints in the Top-10 single charts anywhere in the world. Kiss got a lot of mileage out of being a popular live music phenomenon and teen heroes 1975-1978.

Lick It Up and Heaven's On Fire are pretty well known among those who were teenagers in the 80s in most of Europe. On the other hand, only complete Kisstards know Beth over here.

"Beth" may have been their biggest hit when it was current, but it barely stuck around. "Heaven's On Fire" and "Lick It Up" aged better and still get play. I'd call those two bigger overall hits, despite not charting in the top-40 (and the way Billboard ranks that stuff is dubious, even back in the '80s).

Just checked the top streamed Kiss songs on Spotify...

1. I Was Made For Lovin' You
2. Rock and Roll All Nite
3. Detroit Rock City
4. Heaven's On Fire
5. Lick It Up
6. Love Gun
7. Forever
8. Strutter
9. Crazy Crazy Nights
10. Beth

That looks about right to me. The only surprise is "Strutter" being that high. Although it's the first song on a "Kiss - Greatest Hits" playlist that pops up at the top. People probably get curious, give Kiss a chance, listen to the first song and say that's enough.

Side note: My autocorrect tried to change "Nite" to "Night". It doesn't understand how we roll.

Those Spotify #s are always weird. It had a similar list for my top songs of the year. I NEVER once asked my Spotify to play any of those songs. Those just reflect the top KISS songs Spotify chose, not what the listener chooses.

[Mister Freeze]

Those just reflect the top KISS songs Spotify chose, not what the listener chooses.

Those songs are exactly what users are listening to.

Spotify rankings are actually a more accurate reflection of what people like than the Billboard Top 40, which has always been a combination of sales and airplay (and now streaming), so radio programming decisions literally had a direct influence on chart positions.

I think Spotify positions can get a little skewed when a particular song gets added to a popular playlist. But aside from "Strutter" (a song I like btw), that Kiss ranking feels spot on to me.

I appreciate "Beth," but it's not exactly a song I go out of my way to crank up on Spotify while I'm driving to the grocery store.

[pieceofme]

Lick It Up and Heaven's On Fire are pretty well known among those who were teenagers in the 80s in most of Europe. On the other hand, only complete Kisstards know Beth over here.

"Beth" may have been their biggest hit when it was current, but it barely stuck around. "Heaven's On Fire" and "Lick It Up" aged better and still get play. I'd call those two bigger overall hits, despite not charting in the top-40 (and the way Billboard ranks that stuff is dubious, even back in the '80s).

Just checked the top streamed Kiss songs on Spotify...

1. I Was Made For Lovin' You
2. Rock and Roll All Nite
3. Detroit Rock City
4. Heaven's On Fire
5. Lick It Up
6. Love Gun
7. Forever
8. Strutter
9. Crazy Crazy Nights
10. Beth

That looks about right to me. The only surprise is "Strutter" being that high. Although it's the first song on a "Kiss - Greatest Hits" playlist that pops up at the top. People probably get curious, give Kiss a chance, listen to the first song and say that's enough.

Side note: My autocorrect tried to change "Nite" to "Night". It doesn't understand how we roll.

Those Spotify #s are always weird. It had a similar list for my top songs of the year. I NEVER once asked my Spotify to play any of those songs. Those just reflect the top KISS songs Spotify chose, not what the listener chooses.

What exactly would the ranking be of the most popular KISS songs on Spotify by the general public in your opinion?

As Mister Freeze said, these look pretty much spot on.

[HueyRamone]

Yeah if you don't like Strutter you're not going to like KISS. It is on of their top 3 songs imo.

I guess, but Strutter was always my least fave song on side 1 of Alive!
Just yelling STRUTTER! didnt seem like the best chorus I'd ever heard.